Thursday, July 05, 2007

Hey, Libertas!

I hate to rain on your "Transformers is a great conservative, Republican movie" parade...

The films politics are decidedly pro-American, pro-military, and even *gasp* pro-freedom. Bay’s affection for the American military is obvious in every scene they’re in. They are uniformly portrayed as heroic, extremely competent, selfless, and even kind to Arab children. The theme of the film is spoken out loud more than once: No sacrifice, no victory. And the Autobots have come to liberate us from the terrorist Decepticons because the Autobots believe freedom is the right of everyone. Yes, there is a gentle, somewhat affectionate jab at Bush, but Jon Voight’s Secretary of Defense makes it clear at every turn that the President is running the show.

Steven Spielberg and Bay both exec produced, but make no mistake about it, this is a Michael Bay film all the way; from the booming score to the editing and camera shots. It’s not smart (why does Sam have to save the world by getting that cube to the top of a building when an Autobot could do it in two seconds?), it’s far from perfect, but you’ll have a great time and more than a few hearty laughs despite the lulls. And after all the relativist junk we’ve been suffering through, it does mean something to watch the fight for freedom portrayed with valor, good and evil distinguished, and the dreaded-until-needed military industrial complex save the day.

Am I complimenting the film’s politics because I agree with them? Maybe. Regardless, the world view presented in Tranformers is more than just one that I happen agree with, it’s also new, refreshing, daring, and counter-culture — which counts for something in storytelling.

but ...

Hi there. It's me.

All this reveals is two thing -- first, this sort of culture score-carding is idiotic. It's way, way beyond wet-brained. The Variety review, for example, pointed out how Optimus Prime sounded like Bush when he said "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings." What the reviewer plainly does not know is that is the Big Guy's catchphrase, and if I'd left it out of the first draft a mob of people in cardboard transforming costumes, led by Seth Green and his now full-sized and deadly Robot Chickens, would have gibbed me. I didn't sit there and say "You know what, I should use this movie as a way to express the righteousness of an international crusade of liberation and nation-building." And although I can't speak for Kurtzman and Orci, I don't think that was their gig either.

Second, hopefully this may slooooowly spin you around to the idea that being "pro-American, pro-military and even *gasp* pro-freedom" are not just conservative values. Progressives are also pro-American, pro-military -- in my first draft, the Army guys actually have bigger role, although they're a little grungier and working-class than all shiny and model-y -- and *gasp* pro-freedom. We just believe you serve these values in different ways. Demonizing each other is a way the Bastards in Suits try to jkeep the game going, and keep their little scams in place, so we don't suddenly notice that we're all on the same side, we all support the troops. we all rather like each other, and despite our many disagreements maybe we'd like all the professional hate-mongers to bugger off now, please.

In the spirit of such communality, feel free to kick in $5 for Fisher House using the button to the right. Details here, but short version: Don Murphy, the movie's producer, and I will match your patriotic freedom dollars with filthy liberal sodomite Hollywood monies, effectively tripling your contributions!

I would be remiss not to point out that on our last two American Fundraisers, it was the decidedly conservative blogger Gaijin Biker who was the top donor both times. For the last Fisher House fund-raiser he actually sold one of his motorcycles, I believe. Because that is how we roll in the Kung Fu Monkey House.

174 comments:

Anonymous said...

I'm waiting to see if they

(1)write you a nice reply, and cough up,

(2)write you a smug, snarky, put-down, and cough up,

(3)write you a smug, snarky put-down, and stiff you,

(4)write a smug, snarky put-down on Libertas, but not here, and stiff you, or

(5) stiff you.

I'm betting on some permutation of (4) or (5), but I'm cynical like that.

Anonymous said...

A smug or snarky reply demands some sort of writing skill. I haven't seen much of that on display at Libertas.

Now, a poorly written, hyperbolic, ad hominem, jingoistic put down - that sounds more up their ally.

flyingrodent said...

Ah, it's nice to see someone spraying the internet circle-jerk with cold water.

I hope the movie does well, by the way, and no offence, but I still expect a movie about some toys to suck ass.

It does have Michael Bay's name associated, whatever magic you've pumped into the script.

And I was six when the cartoon was on TV - I must be bitter about my lost youth or something.

Social Justice NPC Anti-Paladin™ said...

Question:
Why does it seem that every Hollywood Sci-fi movie has the conspiracy theory that modern electronics are reverse engineered from alien technology as in Transformers?
I hope every screenwriter that use this tried cliche gets slapped upside the head by the ghosts of the inventors of the Semiconductor device.

Unknown said...

Wow, a combination of 1 and 5. Who saw that one coming?

Stickwick Stapers said...

Libertas reader here, saying hello!

Now, a poorly written, hyperbolic, ad hominem, jingoistic put down - that sounds more up their ally.

The irony is almost unbearable.

John,

Thanks for the clarification on the politics of the movie. That you claim your side of the political aisle values America, the military, and freedom is indeed heartening.

As for your charitable efforts, kudos to you. It is very much needed. However, many of us already have more than one charity to which we donate, so please don't assume that an absence of an avalanche of support means we don't care or appreciate what you do.

A note to your commenters: you'll catch more flies with honey.

Tom Hilton said...

A smug or snarky reply demands some sort of writing skill.

Snarky yes; smug not so much. In fact, the less literate you are, the more likely you are to be smug about it.

Unknown said...

Why does it seem that every Hollywood Sci-fi movie has the conspiracy theory that modern electronics are reverse engineered from alien technology as in Transformers?

Hey, I have a physics degree. Don't look at me for that bit. I'm not selling out the geek brothers like that.

Oh, and I agree we need to cut down on the snark a bit for our visitors. PLAY NICE with our Libertas friends! That's an order!

On the other hand, Stickwick, folks like me have spent 6.5 years being called terrorist sympathizers or traitors. So we're a little short on the honey. But hopefully President Obama will bring some with him when he moves in.

Anonymous said...

*sigh*

I'll be good.

But it is hard when the opening comment over on Libertas is full of such warmth and love. What were those terms he used again?

"... clowns ... elitist a-hole who steals your money, gets other people killed because of their stupidity, and craps on American history and greatness ...
rank idiot."

Whiskey said...

Congrats on your movie doing well. I believe it will do great at the box office, and make you a lot of money (always a good thing for a writer).

But you're wrong on the question of "patriotism", so is DH btw, and here's why you are wrong.

The divide is not between Liberal and Conservative (those labels are outdated) but between "Progressives" and Populists. Between elites and non-elites.

And there is absolutely NO WAY for elites to be pro-American, pro-Military, pro-Freedom.

Elites in this country have a stranglehold on power. An example would be the Open Borders / Amnesty Bill opposed by almost everyone but pushed by the elites: Teddy Kennedy, GWB, Lindsay Graham, John McCain. Opposed to it were populist politicians including Jeff Sessions and "Born Fighting" author and VA Senator (D) Jim Webb. Who were to be fair not the main opponents, but merely responding to the avalanche of calls generated by Talk Radio, the internet, etc.

Elites are represented in politics, the law, the media, big business, and of course Hollywood. They embody a deeply feminized, soft, legalistic, "priesthood" oriented view. You work in Hollywood. You know George Clooney or David Geffen want the public away from public beaches where their mansions are located, and think the solution to genocide is a benefit concert. Or some sort of "deal." Elites can't conceive that most of the world is governed by whoever is more efficient in throwing their opponents off buildings. But most importantly they fear the public most of all. How can they be special if other people move up the ladder? Angelina Jolie would never admit that a 20-year old man with a rifle in Iraq or Afghanistan can do more good than her "humanitarian" efforts will over her entire lifetime. And George Bush and Trent Lott are no different in basic outlook than Michael Moore and Dianne Feinstein (who just moved into a new, $50 million mansion in Pacific Heights).

But the main reason "Progressives" must loathe/hate the military, freedom, and America comes down to naked power. Something you must know well since you've seen it with your own eyes in Hollywood.

Progressives inherit power (you've seen Hollywood's nepotism), marry it (Laurie David), or win the genetic lottery (Brad Pitt's good looks). Above all they don't want to share it (you've seen how spoiled Hollywood power-mongers act, from the Weinsteins to Jolie).

Freedom requires the sacrifice of literally mountains of young men at horrible costs. Who will fight for America and the American Dream but not transgendered multicultural spokesmen who look and act like clowns. These brave soldiers rightfully demand a SHARE of power, given that they make most of the sacrifices. Asking elitist Progressives to share power is like asking David Geffen to abide by his agreement to open up the beach to public access (in return for enlarging his already palatial mansion).

"Priests" ala the Progressives always hate and fear the "soldiers" because they represent a direct threat to the power of the Priests. Given that the legal profession, media, "activists" and Hollywood celebrities are pretty useless in fighting evil which does exist and does threaten ordinary individuals Freedom, there is no way Progressive elitists can embrace the Military. America. Or Freedom. Because it would imply that that a Lance Corporal in the Marines is as important as Sheryl Crowe.

You've seen with your own eyes the embrace of Chavez, Che, Castro, Ahmadinejad, Saddam, and so on by "Progressives" including: Sean Penn, Michael Moore, Oliver Stone, Danny Glover, Susan Sarandon, and so on. Power and the hunger for power at the expense of other's freedom calls to like.

Your script works because it is fresh and original: it's populist in a movie scene dominated by condescending elitist films that adhere to an ideological line. One that is really dictated by power and the desire not to share it.

Best of luck. Your movie is one of the few I plan on seeing this summer. It's nice to see ordinary people as heroes instead of evil props for elites.

Anonymous said...

The Variety review, for example, pointed out how Optimus Prime sounded like Bush when he said "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings." What the reviewer plainly does not know is that is the Big Guy's catchphrase, and if I'd left it out of the first draft a mob of people in cardboard transforming costumes, led by Seth Green and his now full-sized and deadly Robot Chickens, would have gibbed me.

If it turns out that Bush cribbed his applause lines from frickin' Optimus Prime, I will laugh my ass off. Which is good, because I'm not laughing at much that Bush does these days.

Unknown said...

And that's why we don't do that. Because it's wrong.

Although I'll always be unclear on how an Irish bartender with no friends in Hollywood who became a screenwriter and pays his own bills is an "elitist asshole", while the founder of Libertas is an Ivy League swank who lives off right-wing welfare but he's out there defending the common man in the Culture War. :P

Darnit darnit, I SAID I'd be ...

Ahem. Okay, That was the last one.

Anonymous said...

Progressives inherit power (you've seen Hollywood's nepotism), marry it (Laurie David), or win the genetic lottery (Brad Pitt's good looks). Above all they don't want to share it (you've seen how spoiled Hollywood power-mongers act, from the Weinsteins to Jolie).

Wow, George W. Bush is a Progressive? That explains a lot about the Iraq war.

(Hint: when you're the son of a president and the grandson of a senator, you inherited power.)

Anonymous said...

Come on, Rogers. Transformers is clearly a conservative screed. For instance, who could look at Megan Fox and think of anything besides Dick Cheney? I rest my case.

Jack Cameron said...

Given that your original screenplay obviously differs from what's on screen, is there any possibility that you could post your original draft online? I'm sure many people would be interested to read it. Or is it something where the studio technically owns it so you can't do that?
-Jack

Stickwick Stapers said...

John,

Thanks for the response, and greetings from a fellow physicist.

Are you sure that won't be President Hillary moving in? Nevertheless, and with a sincere effort to avoid snarkiness, I shall point out that since a Democrat presidency in 2009 seems probable I'm not counting on much more coming from the White House in future than smooth talk.

BTW, sorry that you've been labeled thusly. It's inexcusable. However, maybe you are in a position to understand what it is like for those of us on this side who have endured similarly nasty attacks. Your first two comments here, at least, make the point that conservatives have not yet cornered the market on ill manners.

Anyway, I am looking forward to checking out your handiwork when Transformers makes it to DVD. (I can't bear the theater experience anymore.)

Best wishes!

Thomas Nephew said...

[stickwick stapers] A note to your commenters: you'll catch more flies with honey.

Who're you callin' flies?

Mrs Tilton said...

John,

you're beautiful.

I'd no idea you wrote Transformers. And, ehh, it's not really my sort of movie; but fair play to you. My brother is, in a small way, part of the Hollywood industry, so I know: work is good. Still, please don't take it as an insult when I tell you that I treasure you far more for KFM than for, emm, a bunch of robots who turn into cars.

Anyway, I'm throwing my liberal sodomite five bucks in the can. Kudos to you for your engagement on behalf of Fisher House. And kudos for engaging with our brethren on the right. You're a better person than I for thinking it worthwhile to do so. But if some of them want to shell out for a cause this worthy, and don't mind that teh librul is going to magnify their contributions, well, kudos to them too.

Anonymous said...

John, was the scene on Air Force One with the President in his socks ordering someone in a faux-Texas accent to rustle him up some ding-dongs yours, or was that someone else's bit? I think maybe the reviewer was in the bathroom during that part, otherwise the entire film would probably have been denounced as defeatist propaganda undermining Dear Leader.

benpeek said...

here you are, man. i deciphered the film for you properly here:

http://benpeek.livejournal.com/575054.html

there's no need to thank me ;)

Mithras said...

Elites are represented in politics, the law, the media, big business, and of course Hollywood. They embody a deeply feminized, soft, legalistic, "priesthood" oriented view. You work in Hollywood. You know George Clooney or David Geffen want the public away from public beaches where their mansions are located, and think the solution to genocide is a benefit concert. Or some sort of "deal." Elites can't conceive that most of the world is governed by whoever is more efficient in throwing their opponents off buildings. But most importantly they fear the public most of all.

Youuuu know. International bankers. Those kind of elites.

-M

Anonymous said...

Woah! Everybody calm down. We're all pro-soldier/pro-military here. After all, without state-of-the-art phosphorous rounds and fighter planes, how exactly are we going to fight the Decepticons when they come for real? And I think we're all anti-Decepticon...right? Rogers, is it true that in your draft, before it got all M:I 3'ed up, that you had "Shock and Awe!" instead of "Bring The Rain!"? I kid. Why can't people understand it's just a movie? It's like they believe advertising has some kind of an effect. (Go buy a Camaro, kids. It equals STATUS.)

Jon Swift said...

Everyone knows that the screenwriter has nothing to do with the real theme of a movie. Transformers is clearly the vision of Michael Bay, the auteur of such great conservative think pieces as Bad Boys, The Rock, Armageddon, Pearl Harbor and especially Kerri Kendall's Playboy centerfold video. You may have intended to brainwash the audience with liberal anti-American subliminal messages but your efforts were subverted by the director.

The Siren said...

I love your blog, and ordinarily I would be happy to oblige you on the "play nice" bit, but alas, I can't. I started reading Libertas after a brief correspondence with Andrew Klavan, who is a gentleman and a good writer. He no longer posts there very much, and Dirty Harry, who seems to be blogger-in-chief now, is truly something else. Here we have a guy who posts pablum about the poor suffering Iraqi people and how we cannot abandon them, while he permits a regular commenter to post open calls for the extermination of Muslims, and remains silent even as other regulars say they have no problem with it. Given that, I would not stay up past my bedtime awaiting any generous gestures from Dirty Harry, much less an acknowledgment that the story writer for "Transformers" finds his interpretation a wee bit questionable.

Forget saying anything when called on an error -- Dirty Harry can't even open another search window and Google, for god's sake. If indeed there are some Libertas readers over here, then for the record: Darryl Zanuck did not edit, or indeed have anything to do with, "Wuthering Heights." Ernst Lubitsch fled neither poverty nor the Nazis. Fritz Lang and Billy Wilder were not German. Katharine Hepburn was typical neither of pre-1960s American womanhood nor other female stars. Govindini Murty in no way originated the thesis that classic-era Hollywood films were more admiring of women than the films of the present. Women's pictures were not a "moralizing-free zone." "Stage Door" does not have a "perfect script," as large sections of it were improvised. "Night of the Hunter" is not "minimalist." And when Kazan, Welles, Wilder, Ford and Capra were still working in Hollywood it was not a halcyon place where all ideologies were equally welcome.

And those are just the ones I remember. Finally I noticed I was getting a throbbing vein in my temple every time I hit the site and I quit reading.

dc said...

Elites are represented in politics, the law, the media, big business, and of course Hollywood. They embody a deeply feminized, soft, legalistic, "priesthood" oriented view.

What about scientists? They train for years to get legalistic "credentials," like Ph.D.s, and they represented a "priesthood" oriented view in which their "experts" demand "data" before any claims are entertained. Plus, it's highly feminized-- they're all a bunch of namby-pampys who sit at a desk or a lab bench "thinking" and "doing math" and "observing data" rather than engaging in a more masculine throttling and asskicking of theorems to force them into proving themselves. Those damn elites.

Anonymous said...

We're all pro-soldier/pro-military here.

Well, not quite all of us, but I'm a pariah.

Anonymous said...

Michael Bay promotes conservative values?...I doubt Michael Bay's political views don't go any deeper than, "will this get me laid?"

SwimLFS said...

This one of the rare time in all of God's Creation that I will demand everyone's attention to point out that Michael Bay and I are alumni of the same college--usually, a point of shame--and that Wesleyan University, in Connecticut, is hardly a bastion of the GOP. It also produced Jos Whedon and Carter/Bayes.

In other words, suck it, Libertas, it was turtles all the way down.

Anonymous said...

For the record, John is joking around a bit. While I did make a contribution to Fisher House last time around, it was far, far less than the value of any motorcycle I own, and I did not sell a motorcycle to raise funds for the donation (although you could argue that I passed on buying a spiffy new handlebar-mounted GPS system).

Of course, the biggest contribution came from John himself, because he matches the total of everybody else, so hats off to him. And his fundamental point about cutting across artificial political barriers is well taken.

Anonymous said...

Why can't people just go enjoy a movie for what it's meant to be? 2 hours of adventure and fun? I didn't go see Transformers for political or religious reasons, and I walked away enjoying the action and comedy and then went on with my life. The movie is just that; a movie. People just have nothing better to do then read between the lines where nothing serious exists... and its getting old...strike that; it GOT OLD years ago.

Don said...

Semi-random notes from a fellow Canuck...

"Freedom is the right of all sentient beings."

Were the administration/GOP (but not conservatives as a whole) not so intent on pissing personal freedoms down the pipes in favour of creating the illusion of security, they might be able to get away with that line. As it is, not so much.

(I still get chills imagining that in Peter Cullen's voice...)

On the con-lib/progressive-populist debate, whatever divisive identifying labels you choose to use, have fun. Whiskey_199's point on elitist power is well taken, but the forces in power who have little interest in sharing are on both "sides" it and use this rhetoric to keep us focussed on each other. Exhibit A: the only true (by your definition) populist conservative GOP candidate, Ron Paul, gets little "mainstream" media attention despite strong online support, while his talking-point-spewing primary opponents (who more closely resemble your defined 'elite') get the lion's share. There are moneygrubbers and working stiffs at both ends of the political spectrum and clear across the 'tween. It falls to all of us to examine and question what anyone tells us to think or believe.

...Michael Bay, the auteur of such great conservative think pieces as... Kerri Kendall's Playboy centerfold video.

I enjoyed the hell out of The Island myself but I think my esteem for the man just went up a notch...

Final point: I read BB (and KFM) and will be catching the movie this weekend, making a third medium through which John Rogers is corrupting me. Awesome stuff, glad to be aboard.

Anonymous said...

Libertas was probably commenting on John's earlier draft screenplay, in which he had the heroic Republicons battling against the evil Demobots.

Anonymous said...

So, it's partly set in the Middle East. The invading bad guys look like Black Hawks and F-22s and MRAVs and other bits of US military kit. The good guys - the, shall we say, resistance fighters - are a few plucky humans and their clunky old cars and trucks.

I grant you that Bumblebee doesn't actually drive into a Decepticon checkpoint and explode with a cry of "Allahu Akbar!" but other than that...

Transformers? Al-Transformers, more like.

Unknown said...

Lindsay Graham is a progressive.

Ha.

Your love for the whiskey is not only apparent in your name, but in your missives as well.

Jerome Comeau said...

It must be remembered that when someone uses the word 'elite', the word they really want to use is 'jew'.

Anonymous said...

Hey Stickwick Stapers and Hilton,

Care to stand up for the fine model of decorum exhibited by the brave patriots over at Libertas?

I especially like the part where they declare that the last 50 years of the United States have been an unmitigated disaster due entirely to the "treason" of liberals.

Love that honey.

Anonymous said...

It would be nice if we could all get over the conservative/progressive mythos divisiveness and realize that we all share some combination of these values. My party registration is actually libertarian, since I believe all viewpoints have the right to be heard, but I've worked mainly with "progressive" organizations over the last few years.

I'm very tired of how the mainstream media and one of our political parties has used divisive language to convince so many people to work against their own best economic interests in order to benefit business interests that really don't reflect our society's overall values.

If you buy into the divisiveness you are part of the problem. Get over it, get over yourself, and let's work to make sure everyone has the rights of freedom and opportunity for economic well being in our society. Otherwise, you're simply putting our entire society and economic structure at risk by not listening to those who are actually working for your economic interests and labeling them as "soocialist" or whatever.

Wake up, people.

Mnemosyne said...

I enjoyed the hell out of "The Island" myself but I think my esteem for the man just went up a notch...

I liked The Island better when it was called The Clonus Horror aka Parts, The Clonus Horror.

Seriously. It's the same. damn. movie. Catch it on MST3K for maximum entertainment value.

Tom Hilton said...

Hey Stickwick Stapers and Hilton,

Care to stand up for the fine model of decorum exhibited by the brave patriots over at Libertas?


Not sure how I got lumped in with Stickwick Stapers on this one. You won't find me calling the wingnuts 'civil'.

Anonymous said...

Nevertheless, and with a sincere effort to avoid snarkiness, I shall point out that since a Democrat presidency in 2009 seems probable I'm not counting on much more coming from the White House in future than smooth talk.

Your sincerity rings a tad hollow when you can't even refer to a Democratic presidency without resorting to a Republican't catch phrase.

Smarter ditto monkeys, please...

Anonymous said...

The Variety review, for example, pointed out how Optimus Prime sounded like Bush when he said "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings." What the reviewer plainly does not know is that is the Big Guy's catchphrase, and if I'd left it out of the first draft a mob of people in cardboard transforming costumes, led by Seth Green and his now full-sized and deadly Robot Chickens, would have gibbed me.

so marvel based Optimus Prime off of bush? What else did they get? "Autobots transform and roll out" did bush say that to?

Anonymous said...

A commenter at Unqualified Offerings alerted me to your fund-raising. I gave $20. Kudos to you on your efforts!

Anonymous said...

thoreau,

Don't you think you should fess up about how you are dogging the movie and encouraging folks to donate money to "bankrupt" KFMonkey for participating in a crappy movie?

Not that it is a bad thing, just looking for some disclosure......

Anonymous said...

I personally don't see a strong conservative message with the movie. In fact there is a stronger theme of distrust in government, that the government lies, doesn't work, is secretive, etc. Right now people are feeling very cynical about the current administration and their policies and like any good work or popular entertainment it is probably tapping into its times.

Michael Bay likes to make things go boom. Featuring the military in his movie helps him to that end. I wouldn't say that this is an endorsement of Decepticon...er...Neocon policies.

And if there are shades of George W. Bush in Optimus Prime, then I have to say that Optimus Prime's public career predates Bushes by several years. It also says something about this president that his greatest foreign policy mandate sounds like something from a 1980's children's cartoon.

Anonymous said...

I personally don't see a strong conservative message with the movie. In fact there is a stronger theme of distrust in government, that the government lies, doesn't work, is secretive, etc.

What are you people, on dope?

Unknown said...

John,

I'm another Libertas afficianado just dropping by to check your post. I love the Libertas blog, but the commenters are about 25% right-wing frothing nutbars, 50% liberal/progressive/lefty trolls who naysay everything and about 25% people like me who just post non-provocative discussions about politics and movies and ignore the others. All I can say is, you can't judge an uncensored blog by the comments.

Sticking to what Dirty Harry wrote, I have this to say:

You're being a jerk. "Dirty Harry" gave a positive go-see-it review to your movie, and you call him out. because his reasons for really liking your movie don't match your politics.

Wait a minute. He didn't say anything about conservatism, or Republicans, or the right-wing. He liked it because it's unrepentantly pro-military and it has some good messages about freedom, and those kinds of movies have been woefully rare since 9/11. You fire back that you're pro-military and a lefty, so somehow he's wrong. He never said only conservatives would like the movie.

I don't make movies, but I do write comic books. If a liberal critic who likes comics with liberal values saw something in my comic he liked and encouraged all his readers to pick up my book, I wouldn't write back a blistering rebuttal. I'd say thanks and maybe POLITELY point out that our politics are different but that I'm glad we can agree on some things.

"Q" the Enchanter said...

Michael, it's a truism of pragmatics (if not of common sense) that we discern meanings from a text that aren't explicitly stated in the text, based on our knowledge of the speaker, the speaker's background, who he takes his audience to be, what meaning he expects them to take away from what he says, etc., etc.

So while it's all very well to point out that "Dirty Harry didn't say anything about x, y and z," that says next to nothing about whether Dirty Harry communicated, and intended to communicate, something about x, y and z. For my part, I don't find hints like his exclamatory "gasp" or his query whether he "compliment[s] the film’s politics because [he] agree[s]s with them?" all that coy. His message is plainly what KFM says it is, viz., that "Transformers is a great conservative, Republican movie." Given that the claim is factually wrong and unethically misleading, KFM I think properly takes DH to task.

brhimberger said...

why do they have to crap up a good movie that has alien robots by dumping their junk all over it?

Unknown said...

Dear Q,

First off, thank you for the civil response.

While you make a good case that this is what someone may deduce from the movie review, it is nevertheless not what was said. And that IS important, because you can state that Dirty Harry is just speaking in code, except that he has no reason to and isn't the type to hide what he wants to say. Furthermore, whatever your suspicions about what he's REALLY saying to his decoder-ring exclusive club, you cannot accuse him of saying it if he hasn't said it. If I say I find redheads particularly attractive, you cannot write a blistering put down of my assumed seething hatred of brunettes.

Here's what Harry said in his summary:
1) "The film's politics are decidedly pro-American, pro-military, and ... pro-freedom"
2) That the Autobots seeking to liberate us from the Decepticons has some real-life parallels, and in a positive way.
3) That it is dissimilar from all of the relativist drek that appears in almost any movie featuring the military since 9/11.
...and finally, the bugaboo you seem to all have:
4) He may be partial to the movie's politics because he agrees with them.

Now, how does it look if he says that he likes the movie because it's pro-military, pro-American and not mired in relativism...and the writer responds, "He's saying it's conservative!!!!" Dirty Harry didn't declare that such values are exclusively conservative, KFM did (and you do, too, apparently).

Do you know what Venn diagrams are? Maybe you saw them in high school. They are visual ways of displaying syllogisms (you know, "All fish live underwater, but not everything living underwater is a fish" or "All fish live underwater; trout are fish; all trout live underwater.")

If you put up a big circle symbolizing pro-military, pro-American values, and then put circles overlapping it labeled "conservative" and "liberal", the conservative circle would be almost entirely inside it and the liberal circle would have much more outside the circle. How much more we could argue about, but you have to admit that there's a significant fraction of the left that is NOT for America and is not supportive of the military (and I don't mean supporting them in the sense of locating them stateside and never using them so that the poor babies are safe).

So, as Dirty Harry addresses his audience of people who are pro-Military and pro-American and tells them this is a movie they will enjoy, he does not exclude liberals/Democrats unless they've self-selected that they are not in that circle.

Finally, KFM is also protesting a bit too much. I know Democrats who support the military; they do exist. As I say, we can debate about what portion of liberals are inside that big circle. But if you were marketing a war movie that was patriotic and showed the American military in a good light, do you think any movie executive would say, "Ah, here's a film the Democrats in this country are going to love!"

I mean, come on.

Anonymous said...

John,

Saw the movie this weekend, had a great time. So glad they got the original voice guy for Prime, that was great fun. The modern cinematographic trick of constantly moving camera in the midst of extended action sequences (I'm not saying the camera NEVER has to move) is getting harder on my eyes as I get older, but it was still a total blast.

I laughed, I got sentimental for my youth (they cost $13 U.S. a piece when I was a kid, and I would save chore money and meager allowance for months at a time to buy just one basic toy), I marveled at the effects (to quote Strange Brew, "Nice effects, eh?"), and the romantic interest chick was totally smoking hot. What a great time at the show!

Thanks for the film. I didn't notice any overt political message in the film, and it certainly didn't feel conservative to me.

(Spoilers ahead, turn back if you haven't seen the film and don't want to know something about it that's not earth-shattering but kind of fun to learn on your own)

Also, had a great moment of recognition of Megatron's voice. There was a moment in the fight where I was almost expecting Megatron to say, "You've failed me again . . . Mr. Anderson." Great fun.

Thanks, John.

No kings,

Robert

Anonymous said...

I have to back up Michael here. I went over the Libertas review several times, just to make sure, and nowhere are the words 'conservative' or 'Republican' used to characterize the movie. Placing these terms in quote marks in response to the review makes it appear as if the reviewer used them in his review, which is either rhetorical sloppiness or intentional deception.

One can, of course, interpret the reviewer's characterization of the film as pro-American, pro-military, and pro-freedom as a way of saying that the film is conservative and Republican. It would be more than a little interesting to see the justification for such an interpretation.

Anonymous said...

Personally, I'm anti-freedom. I'm actually chained to my desk right now.

Scott said...

Bwahaha! Now you're both out $35! Bwahaha!

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I read both positions, and everyone who said that it the words "conservative" and "Republican" where not mentioned in the original script are absolutely correct. However, after determining that Libertas is a decidedly right-wing film, and the review takes the position of the poor right-wingers not having a movie to agree with besides the Transformers, one has to infer that they are stating that the Transformers is indeed a movie which follows closely their ideology. Furthermore, the following sentences illustrate the point far better than anything I could ever state:
"No sacrifice, no victory. And the Autobots have come to liberate us from the terrorist Decepticons because the Autobots believe freedom is the right of everyone...Am I complimenting the film’s politics because I agree with them? Maybe. Regardless, the world view presented in Tranformers is more than just one that I happen agree with..."
That being said, obviously the conservative author of the initial blog believed in the conservative nature of the film he reviewed. Finally, it isn't just possible to be pro-american and left, it's a state of being American. I have heard plenty of far right-winged and far left-winged people say very many things which can only be described as anti-american. Do not mistake fanatical patriotism or xenophobic tendencies as pro-american.

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税理士東京
興信所
興信所
体験入店 銀座
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二人だけの結婚式
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大人のおもちゃ
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Unknown said...

不動産
派遣
インプラント
クレジットカード 現金化
データ復旧

Unknown said...

コンタクトレンズ
キャッシング
不動産
投資
FX
アフィリエイト
toefl

Unknown said...

キャッシングには目的や借入先により何種類も存在する?!キャッシングの種類を徹底分析!金利はキャッシングの落とし穴。キャッシングの金利は法律違反?

Anonymous said...

stupid web site
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生理不順
キャッシング
瀧宮一隆さん最高!!
消費者金融
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ゴールドカード
オートモービル企画
fx 比較

Anonymous said...

バストアップ、豊胸手術なら安心と信頼の池田ゆう子クリニックへ。豊胸、バストアップで高い実績を持っております。
腹部など、自己体内から抽出した皮下脂肪を乳房に移植する。この方法だと豊胸バッグがレントゲンに映らない為、近年注目されつつある。
但し大量の脂肪注入は定着せずに石灰化壊死を生じ、硬結化、乳癌と誤診されるなどの問題を生じる。訴訟も多いために、豊胸移植手技法、移植量に関しては議論されるところとなっている。
本当は、私、豊胸手術をやろうと決めて、カウンセリングは受けて後は手術の日程を決めるだけだったのですがキャンセルして本当に良かったと感謝しています。

Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

高級住宅リッジリングにドイツリングを選ぶ。それは一生涯を共にするのに相応しい価値ある逸品。 ドイツリング専門店ヘルディンヘルト">高級住宅リッジリングにドイツリングを選ぶ。それは一生涯を共にするのに相応しい価値ある逸品。 ドイツリング専門店ヘルディンヘルト">

Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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・販売促進サービスならVMアドバイザーズにお任せください。営業支援独自のマーケティング・エンジニアリング手法によって、クライアントリソースを最適化し、組織に売れる仕組みを構築致します。

Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

ブライダル 幸せな結婚のためには結婚式をしたほうがいいの? 【結婚パレット】は既婚者もたくさん参加する「結婚準備の情報コミュニティ」。だから結婚準備に関するどんなお悩みでもきっと良い答えが見つかるはず。ブライダル 幸せな結婚のためには結婚式をしたほうがいいの? 【結婚パレット】は既婚者もたくさん参加する「結婚準備の情報コミュニティ」。だから結婚準備に関するどんなお悩みでもきっと良い答えが見つかるはず。

Anonymous said...

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Unknown said...

婚約指輪
出会い系
そんぽ24
治験
ソニー損保
三井ダイレクト
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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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出産祝い
会社設立
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フレッツ
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Anonymous said...

テレマーケティング
出産祝い
会社設立
ショッピング枠 現金化
フレッツ
お見合いパーティー
自動車保険 比較
看護師
自動車保険
結婚指輪
釣り
株式投資
RAID復旧
RMT
東京 ホームページ制作
カーボンオフセット
フレッツ 光
お取り寄せグルメ
オーク
データ復元
いびき
Bフレッツ
鼻づまり
腰痛
育毛剤
CAD
データ復旧
マンション フロント
アルカリイオン水
toefl

Anonymous said...

手形割引とは、満期前の手形を第三者へ裏書譲渡し、満期日までの利息や手数料を差し引いた金額で売却することである。手形割引を依頼したものを割引依頼人、手形を割引いたものを割引人、割引かれた手形のことを割引手形(わりびきてがた、略称は割手)という。手形割引通常、割引人は金融機関(銀行) で、割引依頼人はその取引銀行と銀行取引約定書を締結している者(融資取引のある者)である。金融機関は、割引された手形代金を割引依頼人の当座預金/普 通預金へと入金する。手形割引当然、満期日まで待って手形の振出人に支払いを請求する場合に比べて受け取る金額は少なくなるが、即時に現金化したい場合によく用いられる。単に割引と略称されることがある。

Anonymous said...

ハイネットは医師 求人、募集情報サイトです。ハイネットには、医師のみなさんにとって役立つ様々な転職・募集・求人情報が、ぎゅっと詰め込まれています。医師 求人一般には公開されていない求人、募集情報もたくさんあり、自分ひとりで新しい職場を探すよりも有利な求職活動を、ラクラク行うことができます。医師 求人ハイネット では、医師の求人、募集をお探しの皆様に安心と信頼を提供するため、募集・求人情報探しを総合的にサポートさせて頂きます。例えば、情報の探し方や交渉のいろは、面接での対応の仕方まで、親身な専任のキャリアコンサルタントがしっかりとバックアップ。ご登録の際に伺ったご希望条件にそって、あなたの適任・キャリア・スキルを活かせる医療機関の求人・募集情報をご紹介させていただきます。医師 求人もちろん、秘密は厳守されているので、今の勤務先を辞める前から求人情報、募集情報の収集を行う事も可能です。是非、医師 求人、求人情報をお探しの際はお気軽にハイネット までお問合せください。

Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

出会い系
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Anonymous said...

盲導犬は盲目の人の歩行補助に犬が使われた例、盲目の乞食や辻音楽師が犬に引かれて歩く姿は色々な絵に描かれており、その最も古い例はポンペンの発掘品の中に見られ、盲導犬13世紀の中国の絵などその後数世紀にわたって同じような絵が発見されているが、それらはどれも長いロープで繋がれた犬が、視覚障害者を引っ張っている、というものばかりであった。確実な資料では、1819年、ヨハン. ウイルヘルム・クラインというウイーンの神父が、犬の首輪に細長い棒をつけとして正式に訓練したのが最初である。その後1916年に、ドイツ赤十字のシュターリンとドイツシェパード犬協会のシュテファニッツが、第一世界大戦中、戦盲者のために盲導犬を育成しようとオルテブルグに学校を設立し、翌年に盲導犬が作出されて戦盲者の誘導に役立てた。1923年にはポツダムに国立の盲導犬学校が設立され、多数のが誕生し戦盲者の社会復帰を促した。

Anonymous said...

人材派遣
結婚指輪~~


マンガ 専門学校
ブライダル
不動産 東京

Anonymous said...

センチュリー21購入なら首都圏の新築一戸建て・分譲一戸建て・一戸建てを自分で「選ぶ」「 くらべる」ホームプラザ。新築分譲一戸建て情報をはじめ住宅・不動産物件購入に役立つ情報満載です。住友不動産販売(住友の仲介)では、マンション、一戸建て、土地などの不動産物件の最新情報から、不動産の取引のお手伝い、その際に必要となる知識や知っておきたい関連情報など、不動産に関する様々な情報を掲載しております。センチュリー21その他さまざまな詳細条件で探せます。

Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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視聴者にはバーチャル広告…
都市ガスは空気より比重が軽いので
ヘッドランプレベライザー
毎月支払いが発生する…
運転時の視野が広がり
シミになった時は牛乳な…
子供部屋は
元本
日本住宅公団や関西空港といった公的法人に
大人は海藻のコリコリ感
薬品の種類や濃度が法律で決められていたた…
薬事法の改正によって
3階建て住宅が多くなってきて
おさしみは口当たりがよ
縮毛矯正は頭皮上に出ている毛髪を
(読みにくい名前などは…
消防設備点検資格者消防設…
衛生工学衛生管理者衛生工…
従来からのグリセオフルビンに加えて

Anonymous said...

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Menuism割引券地図
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台湾風日本式Slow
夏頃収縮
所有権解釈公式
収入支出
多く場合クライアント
抵抗借換え柔軟性

Anonymous said...

ゴルフレッスン
オフィス引越し

отели в барселоне said...

Very effective piece of writing, thanks for your post.

Obat Kondiloma Akuminata said...

This was a fantastic article. Really loved reading your we blog post. The information was very informative and helpful...

Obat Klamidia Untuk Pria said...

This was a fantastic article. Really loved reading your we blog post. The information was very informative and helpful...

Obat Ambeien Atau Wasir said...

Wasir,| Obat wasir, | Obat wasir alami | Obat wasir tradisional, | Obatwasir herbal | Obat wasir apotik | Obat wasir berdarah, | Obat wasir ampuh | Obat wasir luar | Obat wasir di apotik

teguh wibowo said...

pengobatan wasir yang bagus
obat wasir
cara ampuh obati wasir
obat wasir tradisional
obat wasir wasir alami yang ampuh
harga obat wasir de nature
obat wasir dan ambeien ampuh
obat ambeien atau wasir
obat wasir ambeien stadium 4
obat wasir ambeien stadium 4
obat wasir
obat ambeien
pengobatan wasir
obat kutil kelamin
cara mengobati kutil kelamin
pengobatan kutil kelamin
obat kutil kelamin de nature

Anonymous said...

Penyakit ini umumnya muncul karena penderita mengejan terlalu keras pada saat buang air besar. Dengan mengejan terlalu keras, maka pembuluh darah di sekitar anus dapat melebar dan pecah menimbulkan infeksi dan pembengkakan yang berakhir pada masalah wasir atau ambeien tersebut.

Unknown said...

Penderita Penyakit kondiloma atau Kutil Kelamin yang telah terinveksi disarankan untuk segera melakukan pengobatan secepat mungkin sebelum Virus HPV penyebab kutil kelamin makin banyak berkembang biak di dalam sel darah makin lama dibiarkan akan memperparah kondisi organ vital karena kutil kelamin akan terus membesar sehingga terlihat seperti jengger ayam untuk penderita yang baru tertular kurang dari satu bulan biasanya akan lebih cepat ditanggulangi obat kutil kelamin Paling ampuh dari De Nature dan terbaik ada hanya di http://obatkutildikemaluan.blogdetik.com/ untuk mendapatkan informasi yang lebih jelas mengenai pengobatan kutil pada kelamin silahkan kontak langsung di nomer 0852 808 77 999 atau 0859 7373 5656 Bagaimana mengobati Ambeien itu sendiri. pengobatan yang terbaik untuk Ambeien adalah dari luar dan dalam sehingga Ambeien benar benar tuntas dan tidak akan kambuh lagi. obat Ambeien terbaik "Ambeclear dari De Nature" AlamiAdalah obat Ambeien herbal yang memang terbaik untuk mengobati Ambeien, dan sudah terdaftar di badan obat dan makanan (BPOM) dengan nomer registrasi POM TR: 133 374 041. terbuat dari bahan alami antara lain terdiri Daung Ungu, Mahkota Dewa dan Kunyit Putih.

Anonymous said...

cara yang alami menyembuhkan penyakit wasir ambeien secara alami dengan menggunakan daun ungu serta mahkotadewa aman untuk ibu hamil tanpa operasi cukup dengan menggunakan obat wasir herbal ambeclear terbuat

Anonymous said...

wasir ambeien bisa sembuh tanpa harus di operasi maupun injeksi cukup dengan obat wasir ambeien herbal ambeclear herbal de nature dari daun ungu serta mahkotadewa aman untuk ibu hamil

Unknown said...

Bisa juga melalui uretus ibu kepada anaknya, bila kencing nanah ini mengenai mata , maka akan mengakibatkan terjadinya kebutaan. Tentunya sangat berbahaya sekali penyakit kencing nanah ini bagi penderitanya.

Unknown said...

Penyakit kencing nanah bisa disebabkan oleh beberapa faktor seperti seks bebas, penularan, virus hpv, lingkungan, gaya hidup dan lainnya, Maka dari itu kita harus waspada dengan penyakit kencing nanah ini, karena penyakit kencing nanah sangatlah berbahaya, Namun untuk anda yang menderita penyakit kencing nanah, maka anda tidak perlu khawatir,

Unknown said...

Berapa Harga untuk Obat Wasir Ambeien alami daun ungu AmbeclearAmbeien adalah gangguan atau penyakit yang terjadi pada saluran pencernaan manusia

Pengobatan Ambeien Wasir said...

facebook

Cara Mengobati Wasir Ambeien said...

MANTAB * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Pengobatan Ambeien Wasir said...

MANTAB * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ***

obar herbal manjur alami said...

MANTAB * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *******

Unknown said...

MANTAB * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * **********

Unknown said...

Cara yang sering di lakukan untuk menghilangkan kutil kelamin adalah dengan cara pembedahah atau operasi, cara ini tentu memerlukan dana yang tidak sedikit. metode Pilihan pembedahan yang dapat Anda lakukan

Unknown said...

Kenali penyebab penyakit kencing bernanah sehingga cara mengobati
penyakit kencing nanah dan infeksi saluran kencing nanah dapat dilakukan
dengan benar.

Cara Mengobati Wasir Ambeien said...

MANTAB *

kLINIK oBAT mANJUR said...

Bismillaahirrohmaanirrokhiim ???????????????????????????????????

Unknown said...

Kadang disertai
dengan sakit saat kencing, perih, organ intim terasa panas menyiksa,
gatal,..

kLINIK oBAT mANJUR said...

Bismillahhirrohmaanirrokhim.... *********************************

Unknown said...

Sekitar Vagina Tumbuh Daging, Berbahayakah? Kutil Pada Kepala Penis mirip bunga kol atau jengger ayam, Merupakan Penyakit Yang diakibatkan Oleh Virus.Kutil kelamin, atau disebut juga condyloma acuminata, adalah kutil atau daging berwarna kulit atau keabuan yang tumbuh di sekitar alat kelamin dan

obar herbal manjur alami said...

Bismillahirrohmannirrokhim ........................

Unknown said...

penyakit yang ditularkan melalui hubungan seks : vaginal, oral dan anal. Juga dapat menular melalui persentuhan kulit dengan daerah yang terinfeksi.

Unknown said...

Obat Ambeien Resep Dokter Ambeclear dari De Nature Ampuh Tuntaskan Ambeien Sampai Tuntas

Unknown said...

Ambeien bisa mengeluarkan darah(seperti invander salim yang terkena ambeien dan mengeluarkan darah)

Unknown said...

obat wasir, Adalah  Obat alami berkhasiat dalam bentuk kapsul yang berasal dari tanaman herbal seperti daun ungu, mahkota dewa dan kunyit putih, diberikan pada penderita jika penyakit masih dalam tingkatan stadium ringan

kLINIK oBAT mANJUR said...

Bismillahirrohmannirrokhim ......................................

obar herbal manjur alami said...

Bismillahhirrohmaanirrokhim.... ************************************

kLINIK oBAT mANJUR said...

Bismillahirrohmannirrokhim ...............................

obar herbal manjur alami said...

???????????????????????????????????????

kLINIK oBAT mANJUR said...

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Unknown said...

???????????????????????????????

kLINIK oBAT mANJUR said...

1111111111111111111111111

kLINIK oBAT mANJUR said...

111111111111111111111

obar herbal manjur alami said...

111111111111111111111111111111

Obat Keputihan Herbal Alami said...

1111111111111111111111111111111111111111

Anonymous said...

This was a fantastic article. Really loved reading your we blog post. The information was very informative and

helpful...

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kLINIK oBAT mANJUR said...

obat ambeien wasir paling manjur mengobati penyakit wasir ambeien tanpa efek samping terbuat dari bahan alami herbal seperti daun ungu mahkota dewa kunyit putih

Anonymous said...

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