The most obvious question that springs to my mind is this: if our Team was able to break into the Anti-Team's hideout to steal the forgeries, why didn't they just steal the first painting (and use the theft at the gallery merely as a distraction)? Well, aside from the fact that that would have made for a VERY short episode, of course.
So Hardison's little 'Yall's nasty" comment .. was that improv or scripted.
Fantastic ep.. just the editing of the 2 crews, the competition and then the ending with Sophie and Nate, so much sweet with with sour - awesome over all.
As much of a great mid season finale it is, I am happy we get 2 more eps.
Thanks for all you do.
I hope the cast and crew know how much love there is for the show. :) My twitter stream seemed to be almost all #leverage all night.
Are we meant to infer that Eliot and Noa Tisby's character have a fling immediately following the episode?
I know I recognize Marlowe and Archer as names from something, but I can't place it right now, can you assist?
How on earth is Parker going to deal with Sophie coming back and not going by Sophie anymore? Playing dead was bad enough...
When do we find out about a hypothetical season 3? And if there were to be such a thing, would it be shot in Portland? Y'all seem to really love it there.
Thanks to you and Mr. Devlin and Berg and the whole ensemble. Great show. I've now added my cousin to the list of people I've hooked...
This episode rocked my socks off. I was expecting a lot of good, with both Apollo and Wheaton guest starring, and the entire premise, and you far exceeded my expectations. How it is you keep managing to bring the awesome, I don't know. But kudos, sir, to you and yours on what is now my favorite episode to date.
My two questions are these, do you plan (vaguely or specifically) to bring any of the "evil" team back in the future (either as allies or as opposition), and is there going to be a time jump between 207 and 208?
The fighting! In the heads! That's so absolutely perfect.
Though when I do it I don't later end up wet and chained to my opponent, so apparently I'm picking my opponents poorly. But I would spar Eliot. Once, maybe.
Great casting for this show, lovely to see Apollo onscreen, Noa Tishby's a find and a half--built like a woman who can take a hit and handle heavy ordnance and a hottie to boot.
The first time they hit the auction house, what was Eliot's job? Apart from fate getting him where he needed to be?
Loved loved loved the episode. Wil Wheaton makes a great geeky bad guy.
I did like how the wound on Christian's temple was worked into the fight. That was perfect. Was the fight scene filmed before or after he pulled his own stitches out?
First I must say that this is my absolute favorite episode to date. I laughed hysterically when Apollo and Parker had the show down when they were doing recon as waiters. Brilliant. It was brilliant how each character got to meet what was essentially their evil twin. Im still giddy.
As for my questions. Will the other team be coming back at some point? I liked the whole fighting over the prize to see who is the best of the best scenerio.
Also, I just wanted to know if you realized the amount of screaming coming from fangirls across America during Chris' fight scene. I think I heard echoes...
Hats off to you and the entire crew. This was an amazing episode, WELL deserving of all the hype and build-up. This is definitely my favorite episode this season.
I've only got one question. Was it my imagination, or did Parker honestly show the slightest, tiniest bit of sadness during Sophie's eulogy? Well, right before she was creeped out by the whole death act.
Keep up the awesome job, guys. The episodes you've been punching out are nothing short of brilliant, and it's no surprise Leverage has become my favorite show on TV.
Best ep this season (in my humble opinion). Where'd you get the idea for the pudding, though? Also, I'm noticing more and more Parker/Eliot interactions - to slow the Parker/Hardison arc, or is it something more?
First off, thank you for not doing what I think you were gonna do!
NOw on to the question, I have noticed in flashbacks we always see "lil Parker" Will we see any Lil other team members? you know, How grumpy was Lil Eliot, Lil Hardison the first time he worked a keyboard or even Lil Nate and the time he lead his entire school in taking back his school as it was about to be foreclosed, Oh wait wrong Nate....
Did Noa do her own stunts/actually fight with Chris in the scenes? You definitely should work her into more story-lines. How could Eliot resist a woman that can hold her own against him and has a good chance to kick his butt? Maybe work the fling into some episodes next season? (crossing fingers)
Also I think having Apollo in the show more often would be an awesome addition. Love the guy! I think him and Parker would make a great couple.
Excellent as usual. It wasn't *all* from Wil's electric sexuality, but hey, use whatcha got.
Ilex and I had one of those questions that seems silly to ask (but clearly that's not stopping me): When we see Sophie's tombstone the first time, it says Katherine, and the second time, it says Sophie. Are we meant to understand that she had it changed? (Other options include her having faked her own death before, although this did seem like a new grave...) -- or is it a more mundane explanation?
Although the aliases are supposed to be from some film that echos the con, I'm hoping the aliases are from Raymond Chandler's Philip Marlowe and Ross Macdonald's Lew Archer. Both fictional detectives frequently ended up helping people they didn't necessarily like because they didn't seem to have much choice in the matter. Both are also known for having pity and compassion for sad people in bad situations.
But I'd like an answer to that alias question as well, please.
Wonderful episode, BTW. It lived up to all the hype and more! And kudos for making Wil the "really" bad guy. I actually did not see it coming and that is rare, for me, and totally FUN!
As I have watched it only three times so far, I 'm sure I'll have more questions once I am finished watching it. This could, however, take several days...
Brilliant episode. As I said to Dean, the editing of the two teams near the end of act 2 (or was it 3? Dad called in the middle so I couldn't keep track) was quite well done. I love techniques like that.
You and Amy already answered my quibble about the tombstone. It just didn't seem clear in the episode that SHE was the one who changed the tombstone. But as Sophie is on the tombstone, will she still be called Sophie by the group? I'd assume so, it's all they've ever known, but it will be interesting. And I do wonder if this Katherine is her real name. We've been hinted at it before, but to choose Katherine twice has to mean something.
Another thing I'm curious about is the woman that bumped into Starke near the end of the episode. Will we be seeing her again? I think I've seen her before, but I'm just not sure where... Can you help?
Finally, inspired choices for the aliases. Marlowe for Philip Marlowe, am I right?
Oh wait, there was one more thing: I've always been intrigued by the Holocaust (for numerous reasons), so thanks for making that a part of the episode :)
So glad we get another episode next week as if the fact that I had two new episodes tonight (since I was on vacation last week) wasn't amazing enough!
PS. Since I've delayed enough on posting this comment, let me (be hopefully the first to) say CONGRATS ON A THIRD SEASON!!
Anything I say would basically be a rehashing of things already said, but I just wanted to make known that I am in full support of a Chaos return/robot spin-off.
Also, major kudos for casting a woman who looks like she actually consumes food on a regular basis. And on top of that, is a totally smokin' ass kicker. Very refreshing.
Speaking of casting, (see what I did there? I'm so clever) how did the casting of the rival crew go? I already know some details via Wil's blog about his character, but let's hear your side of it and more about the other three.
Loved, LOVED the episode! Definitely the best so far. The Other Crew was just as awesome as Our Crew and for favourite scene I seriously can't decide between the first non-fight between Eliot and the Mossad lady (just fabulous how they saw all the moves in their heads)and Parker/Apollo "crossroads" discussion about birds... You guys are the best!
And please confirm those third season news are true...
The "fighting in their heads" reminds me of Midnighter from THE AUTHORITY. I see you co-wrote, John (at least according to one site!), so -- deliberate homage, or just clever way to get out of the inevitable damage they'd cause fighting each other in that antiquities room? Either way, it was awesome to see, and unique for TV. As was Miss Tishby in her role. Was the idea to try to dodge some of the "Hollywood Hardcase" tropes? Having her be ex-Mossad who actually spoke mostly Hebrew, even in casual conversation, was impressive, as was having someone who wasn't rail-thin. And Wil. Bring Back Will. I know that's not a question, but hey. You've said it's hard finding plots that Hardison can't code out of in 20 minutes; seeing Chaos wreak the team in that fashion would be interesting...
Loved Parker's funeral dress. Thank you so much for having her realize that the one thing a funeral really needs is a little sex appeal.
Also, Sophie's real name. Either it's something embarrassing like Gretyl von Stoolface or it's Jack Higgins meaning she's the result of the most awesome sex change operation in history. Which is it?
Oh, and bring Wil Wheaton back even if you have to meet his outrageous salary demands.
Awesome, awesome episode. this episode would seem to be the perfect bookend to season 2a, with the "burial" of the Sophie identity at the end of the show, as well as the reappearance of the Nate/Sophie relationship, but I'll take any extra Leverage ya got, since I'll have to wait months after the two-parter until we get new Leverage.
comments and questions, all intermingled:
- love the casting of Wil Wheaton and the Kobayashi Maru reference on the Leverage universe's version of "Mirror, Mirror" - one of the best Trek TOS episodes. You should have gotten Wil to make his facial hair into the Mirror Spock evil goatee. :)
- So if Marcus didn't send Sophie the bomb, why was he so sure at the funeral that it wasn't an accident? And if he was, wouldn't he have been trying to find out who killed her?
- who were all the attendees at the fake funeral? people paid by Nate to show up? or were they friends with Sophie as "Katherine" (assuming that's the identity that she used to purchase/rent her place that was blown up)
- The mental fight between Christian and Noa's characters: love the idea of something different from the conventional fight scene. Homage to the Jet Li-Donnie Yen mental fight in Hero? Although my first thought was of my favorite Warren Ellis character: The Midnighter from the Authority, he with the unique superpower of envisioning any fight before it starts.
- was interesting to see how the Leverage gang was viewed by former compatriots of the underworld, as explained by Marcus. The nastiest crew this side of the Atlantic? So ironically, even though they've turned to do good, their criminal reputations are still being burnished by the jobs they're doing.
- LOVED the scene at the bar with the two groups hanging out at the end with the competitiveness (Beth/Apollo) and the comparisons (Christian/Noa). Its the super-team trope of pitting two groups against each other and having them be buddy/buddy at the end. Just more opportunity for Competence porn! (which I admit to being a big fan of)
Very good ep! Not sure how sexy, but wil's character really seemed to gel with the others, oddly enough. Bring him back in a pardon/partnership ep. Soon!
A good episode! Lots of really great parts (the high noon showdown, especially was awesome).
The story seemed to come to a resolution really quickly in the final part. Like that they noticed the time, and wrapped up everything really quickly. Maybe a 2 parter would have been good for this.
When I first heard of the Blockage team, I thought they'd be a little more..evil..conning wrong what was once conned right....perhaps there's a truly evil team still out there......
The initial face off between Eliot and Noa Tisby. There's a story of Miyamoto Musashi meeting a samurai on a small bridge. They each drew their swords, locked eyes, then seethed their swords and walked away, realizing they were equals and one would never beat the other (Claremont would tell this story with every other Wolverine tale he did). I was wondering if the "flash forwards" was a reference to that.
And speaking of Noa Tisby's character....where can I find a nice Jewish girl like that? (and does she like beagles?)
To Bardic Lady: Fling? I fully suspect Eliot and Noa had one-night-only break-the-bed, wreck-the-room, send-the-neighbors-running-for-cover S-E-X.
Laughed aloud at the "shootout" between Hardison and Kaos only because Aldis Hodge could break Wil Wheaton into messy pieces.
You have been making me very happy so far with Kane in boxers and sweat in 2.02 and now sweat and black wife-beater; still waiting for a swimming pool and speedo.
Any chance of snagging that fellow from Vancouver who was singing with Aldis at Chris' birthday show as a guest star? What's his name, Jorden, Johnson, something like that?
The "evil" counterparts are saved, Stark gets a taste of being a good guy, Chaos turns out to be REALLY evil -- overall just a lot of great twists and turns and resolutions that were very satisfying and that I did not expect.
There were lots of little moments (like the geek shoot out!) that stand out, but one of the nicest was the interaction between Beth Riesgraf and Apollo Robbins, especially in the air duct. They play off of each other so well.
Oh, I do want to mention the scene at the end between Nate and Sophie, too. Beautiful and sad.
Stark being a grump about doing the right thing (even though it was just a trade for the "Van Gogh"). Shows that it still takes a special kind of thief to be Robin Hood
WHEATON~!
Sophie's scene with Hardison in the van - "That's the smell of hard work"
I'm not even going to ask the "Can a few cranks on a generator power the equipment", that's how much I trust this show.
Somewhere between fanfic and a spec script, there must be a happy medium, because I keep thinking of things I'd like to see the Leverage crew do, but I am not yet a full-fledged writer. Awaiting that blog post
Congrats on Season Three!
I really hope this isn't the end of the Blockage (nice one Video_Beagle) team...since Stark would be well-suited as Sophie's counterpart, maybe Sterling has his team to take down Nate? Hmmmm?
Great episode. But wasn't it "Katherine" that they buried? Nate's comment to his evil twin seemed to say as much. And if so, why did the tombstone say "Sophie Devereaux" at the end?
And yeah, I realize I just became the "I Grok for Spock" guy.
Questions about the imagined fight scenes, because the concept was cool but the execution was too amazing for words: Whose idea was it to do the scratched film effect on those? Did that come straight from Amy's script?
I really enjoyed this episode - I like the almost friendly rivalry between Parker and her counterpart and Eliot...well, thanks for that scene, that's all I have to say.
That 'evil' team is too good not to bring back eventually, so add my vote to doing that when you can.
I would like to know what the old couple will do with the painting - technically it is still stolen so do you have a Word of God as to how they dealt with that?
And finally - general question - I'd like to know if you have a fantasy script in your head in which David Tennant stars, and if so what would he be doing?
I have to ask....what is the star trek connection? Directors and actors? Loved the Boston skyline shot and Sophie's better attempt at sounding Bostonian....didn't need the Reveah Claw or Meffa big hair for that one. Loved this episode.....my favorite so far.....hoping we'll see some of those characters come back in the future. Kelly
So everybody had an 'evil' twin on the other team except for poor, dead Sophie. Any chance we'll ever see Lindsay Price as her opposite number someday?
First, if Sophie could lift the vase/bomb over her head after the pudding was added, what was preventing her from slowly putting it on the ground and walking away?
Second, if Sophie had died in an explosion, there wouldn't have been an open casket! She would have been pink mist.
And if "Catherine" was being buried, then why did the tomb stone say Sophie Devereaux?
Loved the two teams, especially because for awhile there it seemed like our crew might be the only high-rate criminals in the world. Nice seeing that their equals are out there and that they all have awesome reputations.
My question: Nate knew a little bit about this new team from chasing them. He's chased a lot of people. We know he caught Sophie before in the past, did he ever catch Hardison, Parker or Eliot or did he just chase them?
First of all, wet Eliot in a wifebeater with cuffs … from the bottom of my shallow, lascivious heart, I thank you, sir.
Second, fantastic show! Team v. anti-team, with all the resultant chaos (ahem), was delicious to watch. And the "gunslinger" scene between Hardison and Chaos was hysterical. (And, yeah, members of anti-team MUST come back!!)
Third, as others have said, thanks for giving us a woman who actually has padding on her bones and who looks like she might actually be a match for Eliot. While cuffed to Eliot … Sorry.
I loved the scar exchange. A bit of Lethal Weapon 3 perhaps? But you know it's what these two would do. (And was Christian's scar real? I can't imagine you have to fake any for him.)
And, yeah, I would so love it if she were the sniper who shot Eliot. A romance made somewhere south of heaven, where a date becomes Fear Factor. Ah, romance …
Also, Parker creeping out over dead-not-dead Sophie was just so Parker! Good to see she's not losing her, eh, Parkerness.
And huge, HUGE congrats on Season 3!!! Hip hooray and huzzah!
You'll have probably answered this by the time you get this far in the questions, but has there really been a renewal order given for Season Three? I haven't found anything online anywhere except for this comment thread. Would love to be proved wrong, though, by someone coming in and posting a link.
Made of Win, Rogers. Made of Win. As others have mentioned, the not-fight was awesome (and way to go on the casting there), pretty much every bit with Parker and Apollo was awesome, and I quite enjoyed the gunslinger showdown bit. The tombstone thing threw me some, but whatever.
Here's an actual question, albeit not specifically related to 207. Quoth the season-3-pickup press release: "LEVERAGE scores tremendously well with DVR users, garnering an extraordinary 66% growth among adults 25-54 when comparing Live to Live + 7 viewing." Do you have any insight into this? Do you know how it compares to other new scripted cable dramas?
Congrats on a third season! It's well deserved. May i suggest an international premier for season three? I'd love to see the crew stealing the crown jewels or something.
Chaos was great, and had the best line of the ep with his baby quip! But I liked him, why'd you have to turn him evil? :-P
I hoped the team would overcome the other team thanks to the cross training they'd been doing, to show how they're stronger because they've helped each other, rather than just teaming up for money.
I loved how you emphasised that they're still criminals, and to hear their reputation among other criminals was great.
Hardison going old school! Love it.
Now i want to see Eliot in a proper sword fight, please. (is that your insurance agent i can hear crying?). Also good to see him speaking another language. I get the feeling Eliot's a lot more clever than he ever lets on or is given credit for.
And i cant believe everyone has overlooked Parkers amazing acrobatics with the lasers. That was wicked cool! Seriously.
Is there any chance if we harass the network that they will rethink their strategy and wont have a break mid season? I have zero patience.
For what was billed as a penultimate episode, you guys sure didn't let us down!
The entire show was perfect, from the casting to the pace to the ending. There were so many mood and emotion changes I can see why you were going with this to originally end the summer season.
I especially liked the pudding to stabilize the nitroglycerine motion bomb. Perfect usage of an item and it actually would work.
Folks here keep calling Dunne's team the "evil" version. Don't do that, folks...they are just on a different (read: financial gain) mission than our Leverage team. It would be good to see everyone except Dunne's character and Chaos (sorry, Wil, you turned on everyone in the episode over jealousy) work with the team in the future in some capacity. Could also set up for a blown mission as...OK, I am giving my own ideas up here!
My question is: Sophie seems to have been in a funk since the departure of the boyfriend as to who she is. Will this have an effect on her abilities as a grifter?
Oh, man, I love the anti-team so much. I would welcome a return appearance by these guys. I laughed and laughed and laughed at Elliot and Ms. Mossad falling instantly and totally in Fight Love.
This was my favorite episode of the season, and possibly my favorite episode of the entire series. In part for the overall fun, in part for the wonderful character work by Ms. Bellman, and in part for the continuing, worrisome hints that Nate Ford is, at his core, Not a Very Nice Person At All. Kudos also to Mr. Devlin, whose direction gets ever more adept, lively, and stylish.
My "I am a huge comics nerd" question: I see other folks referencing the sequence in which Elliot and Ms. Mossad play out entire fights just by glancing at their respective stances as a tribute to the Midnighter. Me, I'm thinking Ogami Itto of Lone Wolf & Cub, yes? Or was it just a cool thing to do?
Was the irony in having Eliot's mirror be a former Mossad agent, when the Leverage team's caper revolved around recovering a piece of art stolen by the Nazis, intentional?
And may I say that my Trek flag flew free when I heard the Kobyashi Maru reference. }}:-)
Why wouldn't our team just move a table under Sophie's bomb? You can stack up some magazines to get it the right height, and, viola, walk away without moving the bomb.
Congratulations on the renewal for a third season. Certainly made my day. Sure wish we could have the 15 episodes run now instead of being split. But oh well, first season dvd and current seaseon tape will have to suffice.
Last nights episode was truly awesome, looking forward to watching it again. Keep up the great work.
I have to admit, last week's episode made me hesitant to get my hopes up about this but oh my god! It was hard to sit in my cube farm and watch this without busting a gut every other minute, for all the reasons listed already. Beautiful and almost perfect.
The music though... will we be getting some new score for the second half of the season?
word verify: parumt - What the Little Drummer Boy just did.
Jon, when, if you know, will Leverage be coming onto UK screens, I have held off torrenting because I really want to experience the show on television.
Are there any plans for a blu-ray release of the show? Very much would like to buy the season 1 set, but want the glorious HD I know it exists in on the other side of the cable broadcast.
Oh my goodness. the Competence Porn...I'm still turned on. Kudos to all and sundry.
I liked that Parker had the idea for Pudding right off, but it only went halfway. With pudding in the mix, you could have taken the entire vase and carefully placed in the freezer that was behind Sophie in almost the entire scene. Even if the bomb had gone off after being placed, it still would have been inside a freezer.
I like it that Sophie was the one that Kaos, and supposedly everyone else, was always scared of. But then again it may be because they saw her one woman show. "An Evening with Lady Macbeth"
I will say that this episode sort of points up something that is easy to forget, and that is, that making Hack Fights visually interesting is kind of tough. The cut back and forth between Hardison and Kaos when they're trying to gain control of the systems accomplishes it, but it's kind of hard to use visual elements in that sort of thing without running up against the cold hard wall of what the audience actually knows. While pretty, the visual interface elements in the movie "Hackers" kicked out any person who had actually ever worked with a computer. Ugh.
Sophie's breaking my heart. Make her stop.
Also: Nate is in dire need of a swift kick in the head, spiritually. Any chance we'll see D.B. Sweeney again?
I don't really have a question just wanted to pass along my congratulations on pick up for season 3.
I look forward to the craziness that you and your writing staff will cook up. Oh and may I just suggest more wet Eliot please?
Although, I was curious when Eliot brings Moussad lady out from the basement area his wonderful hair is completely dry so was there a hair dryer hidden somewhere?
Question about dvds (know you can't answer, but maybe you can direct me to who at Paramount/MGM to contact)
I love Leverage, and wanted to introduce the show to a hearing disabled friend. I was surprised and disappointed there's not captioning/English subtitles on the dvds. Is there a reason for this? Can we get them on the next season?
P.S. Congrats on Season Three and am really enjoying these latest eps of Season Two.
I second briddie on the love for the competence porn with Eiot and the bomb. I took it (and the way Nate immediately turned to him for advice) as a subtle (or as subtle as a bomb can be) reminder that Eliot's experience and talents are much darker than the rest of the team's. It was a nice callback to the Mile High Job, where Nate asked Eliot how he'd go about taking someone out, and Eliot was immediately able to tell him.
I also liked the fact that Eliot spoke Hebrew. We all know Sophie is a one-woman UN, but it would make sense that, given what we know of his background, Eliot would have to be able to pick up languages, too. Very nice reminder that there's definitely a brain under those muscles and that hair. And wifebeater. And handcuffs. Damn …
Also cool that Noa Tishby's character (what was her name?) knew about Eliot. Which raises the question, does the Mossad know about Eliot? And how? (Season 3, I'm just sayin'.)
And Parker cartwheeling through the lasers? Epic. Honestly, the whole damn thing was just made. of. win.
I'd like to join in the fangirl choir thanking you for putting Eliot in a wet tanktop. I would also like to add my adoration over casting Noa Tisby as his counterpart, she was hot and looked competent. Please bring her back sometime (preferably to kick Sterling's ass).
Really really loved this episode.
Now, my question: What is Hardison's hacker alias?
Oh yeah, forgot to add... Apollo and Parker where adorable! Especially liked the scenen in the airduct. Please bring him back to - maybe in season 3? Congrats on that btw :)
I started watching Leverage because I loved Tim Hutton in Nero Wolfe. I've been thrilled with co-stars from that show - Saul Rubinek and Kari Matchett - showing up on Leverage. Any chance you could get Carlo Rota in as a bad guy? I loved him in the Wolfe series also. He's good as a good guy - but he's GREAT as a bad guy. *lol*
And I have come to love ALL the characters of Leverage. So glad to hear we have a 3rd season to look forward to - to learn more about these people.
Loved the episode! Fantastic in so many ways that have already been mentioned in the comments. But no one has mentioned the Post-It note! That cracked me the hell up. Oh, Hardison.
True or false: Hardison and Parker have weekly Star Trek viewing sessions, and they saw the new movie six times.
I lovelovelove the male thief Parker was having her friendly rivalry with. I hope he comes back every now and then, not as a romance, but just as a friend. Parker is getting a bit more used to emotions and normal interaction, but I'd love to see her hanging out with someone as crazy as she is. Their bird conversation was really cute.
The female Mossad agent was awesome as well. Props for getting a woman who actually looks like an ass-kicker. The mind-fights between her and Eliot were great, as has been said many times. I wish their actual showdown had been a bit bigger, though. I was hoping for some whisk-fu, appetizer-weapon style craziness between the two of them, and maybe some running around trying to find higher ground or get the jump on the other person. Isn't one of the main principals of Krav Maga (which I'd assume the Mossad agent would primarily use) to utilize whatever you can as a shield or weapon? I can't really believe that a professional female fighter would continue to fight an equally well-trained man bare-handed, since odds are he's stronger than her.
I loved the bit where she and Eliot were comparing scars, though. And Eliot speaking Hebrew!!! (How long is it going to take the rest of the team to realize Eliot's a lot smarter than they give him credit for?)
If the Mossad agent could show up again in an episode or two, just because she's badass, that would be amazing.
Can Eliot fight a ninja-type at some point? Someone who's a fighter, but who fights with trickery and stealth and such. I'd love to see him trying to get his hands on someone who just keeps slipping away (or trying to figure out what the hell is going on cause his opponent is wearing night-vision goggles and has turned out the lights in the room so Eliot can't see anything). It'd be a possibility for another female fighter, too.
Oh, and I really enjoyed the negative interactions between the team in this episode. Eliot needling Nate in the living room, Sophie getting irritated with Parker, Sophie undervaluing what Hardison does in the van . . . I love those kinds of moments in every episode. The annoying, frustrating aspects of friendship.
The song playing while Sophie and Nathan were in the graveyard was gorgeous. I've heard it on the show before; is it going to become a kind of "romance theme?"
Parker diving through the moving lasers to get to the painting was a Crowning Moment of Awesome.
Would not normally just write to congratulate on an episode, but with the news of a third season being approved and this being the best episode of the season so far.
I have to ask will Wil Wheaton be back his Chaos character needs retribution. Also having read his blog this week, he has been having a very bad week and could do with a pick up.
Congrats on the third season, John! After that episode, I'd say it was well earned; probably my favorite of the whole series.
This episode was chock full of things to love, between the general idea of the crew facing off against their "evil twins", to the mental showdown between Elliot and his Mossad counterpart (and the Jaws homage they go through at the end), to the pickpocketing war between Parker and her counterpart, and...there's just too many to list.
My favorite moment, though, was just after Sophie told Nate to get out and let her drop the bomb alone. You see him run off, and while the camera's close on Sophie, you can see Nate juuuuuuuust out of focus, peeking his head out to make sure she's okay.
My question: Was that scripted? Or did Dean/Tim/Chris/you/whatever combo of two or more improvise that on the set?
And while we're at it: The gravestone for Sophie Deveraux. I thought she was "buried" under the Katherine alias? When did they bury the Sophie alias? Or am I just leaving a penny on the fun train tracks?
Now that's a good episode. I laughed 3 times out loud.
Pokey Parker didn't work as well this time around.
You evil, evil man! So close to a smootch.
This show needs a song. I've started one, but need some help to finish it.
The Leverage Song
There's a girl named Sophie that I'm dream-ing of, Just need to figure out if what I feel, is love, Should I try to fight it, oh, oh, uh, oh, Does she feel the same, oh, oh, uh, oh, Got a funny feelin' that's not her name,
There's a girl named Parker that I've seen, around, Jumping out of windows just to knock me to, the ground, Shouldn't try to fight her, no, no, na, no, Can you feel the pain, oh, oh, uh, oh, You just gotta trust her, running her own game,
Please suggest changes. It could definitely use some choruses for Elliot and Hardison, and maybe a bridge for Nate!
Yay for some Eliot almost-shirtlessness! And there was water involved. Be still my heart.
Wil Wheaton IS the sexy (aside from Aldis, Christian, and Timothy, though not necessarily in that order!).
I loved the match-up between the two crews. Too much fun. I did notice the other team kind of lacked a Sophie - was Marcus Nate and Sophie rolled into one?
Can we get an episode where Hardison is locked up and the team finally respects the van? The Mile High Job seemed to have shades of this, but I'd love to see one where he is totally out of commission and they realize just how much harder their jobs would be without him being all "whiffy" in the van.
However, coming after the Top Hat job, we have a second con where it looks like it's all gone pear shaped and then it turns out it was all according to plan after all.
I realise this is a time honoured way of telling con job stories, but I'm beginning to miss the stories where a team plans a con, executes the plan and encounters genuine problems they hadn't planned for and still overcomes them. Are we getting more like that at all in what's left of the Summer episodes or in the Winter season?
Because too much of the stories like this one and Top Hat and it feels like it's all a con on the audience to me. And while it did fit the theme of Top Hat and the style of Two Live Crew, too much more and I'm not sure I'll still enjoy being conned.
If I end up not getting invested in the story and the con because whatever happens, it was all part of Nate or "Sophie"'s plan then I'll probably lose interest. Don't worry - I trust you guys and I don't see myself stopping watching the show at all right now.
But please tell me we'll see something different soon?
All I can say is "Wow." Totally blew my socks off with this one, it was 42 minutes of squee and awesome.
Pretty much everyone's said what I wanted to say, so I can only repeat that Wil Weaton rocks, Apollo is a tiny god (sorry) and needs to star more often and the whole Mirror, Mirror thing was just fantastically well done.
And massive congratulations on Season 3! That news totally made my day.
I wish I could think of some smart questions for you but the Fun Train bowled me over and left me speechless. Kudus all round, guys, that was just a fabulous piece of television.
Going to put in my two cents regarding the ep. First, it doesn't surprise me at all that it was Sophie that Chaos was so scared of. Sophie is the almost certainly the one with the longest criminal career. She's older than everyone else on the crew except for Nate and Nate's criminal career started barely a year ago. Plus, I tend to imagine Sophie's career starting at around age three helping her mom run scams.
Note to whoever said that Sophie was the only one without an evil twin: I disagree. I see Stark as being a dupe for Sophie or maybe as an unholy amalgam of the her and Nate. He was a grifter who worked with her for years, and as an art thief to boot. He's Sophie if she decided to run a criminal crew.
Finally, a real question. I find it stunning that Stark didn't check the painting to make sure it was the one that he was after. Honor among thieves just doesn't cut it. Normally, I'd just accept that the forgery would fool him at least for awhile, but he painted the forgeries himself! I'll admit that I don't know enough about art and forgery to call BS on that. It could be that his forgeries were good enough to fool even himself for at least a while. Was he just counting on goodwill from his ex-partner (Sophie)? Was he counting on his rep to protect him from that because it's assumed he'll wreak some horrible vengeance if someone pulls something like that on him? Did we just not get to see him checking the painting in the interest of saving screen time?
@JP Corkery: For Top Hat Job, I didn't get the impression at all that the problems they encountered were part of their plan. Between the difficulty getting into various places, necessitating the improv with CEO-in-a-box, and Evil Erik with a K deleting all the copies of the report before they could snag one, I very much got the feeling they were making stuff up on the fly.
It's just proof of how good they really are. Even in a tight spot, with a plan going south, they can still pull out the win.
There was a lot to love about this episode, and I'm sure the other fans will cover those things in the comments pretty exhaustively. There was a lot I loved here. But was it completely necessary to open the episode with Nate and Sophie conning an innocent secretary through the threat of sexual violence? "Your boss is a mass-murderer-slash-rapist, you're his type, and he's coming back tomorrow"? Really? REALLY? Way to advance the culture of rape in America. Way to pander to the assholes who think jokes about rape are funny, or that making women into victims is funny. I hope lots of twelve year old boys learned their lesson, that threatening women with sexual violence will help them get their way! The really amazing part is that the little threat-of-rape-and-murder plot was completely unrelated to the main plot, and they could've distracted the secretary with ANYTHING - which I guess means yall think it's just a hilarious and funny joke when women are made to live in fear. I expected better from this show, which is why it hurts more to see this here than it does to see it everywhere else (which we do, every day). Do better. I love this show. Do better.
(if I get an answer that's like, "oh, Nate and Sophie told the secretary offscreen that they had the wrong man," I'll be even more disappointed. I don't want a retcon or a Watsonian explanation; this kind of fuckup isn't like fucking up Hardison's perl script. Just please think about how you can make your show a little less rapey, would you, please?)
I'm SO HAPPY for the entire Leverage team -- and US FANS -- that S3 is locked in!!! Last night's episode was absolutely wonderful! As everyone before me has already said, it really had it all. Loved the way things were left between Nate and Sophie. And LOOOOOOOVED Eliot's wet hair, "costume," props and "action" in his last few scenes! (Start thinking S3 now.... :)
*inches past the psycho-rant-person two posts up* Yeah... take your meds.
Fun episode. Good byplay between the counterparts on each team.
For those who keep asking about the tombstones... at the funeral, the tombstone read 'Katherine Clive' (given that there is also a poster from her 'Sound of Music' appearance, I'm guessing that the folks attending knew her through that). It's not until the end scene that there is a new tombstone that reads 'Sophie Devereaux'. Given Gina's dialogue in that scene, it makes a great deal of sense that she'd have the stone replaced for the symbology.
And yes, I'll add my own voice to the remarks about why couldn't they just take care of the bomb in a less hectic manner. Although it seems that the things that tend to stick in my brain (the bomb and the 'head south from Nebraska to reach... Iowa?? bit from 2.02) are things that grate because of one fairly minor inconsistency. With the Iowa thing, a quick ADR swaping 'Iowa' with 'Kansas' could fix it entirely. And with the bomb this episode, if Sophie had never lifted the bomb up before dropping it, no issue.
*shrug* Still ends up as great television, either way. Looking forward to the rest of season 2, and very much glad there will be a season 3.
If we're going to get all nitpicky about the bomb, it's interesting how TV explosions always go out, never up and down. (Sorry neighbor!)
So when y'all were casting for alter-Eliot, did you specifically set out to find someone with matching hair? Or was that just the universe aligning in your favor?
Okay, I've been thinking about the whole Sophie name and tombstone things all day. I know that Katherine Clive's tombstone was at the beginning and Sophie's was at the end. I don't think she switched them out. I think Sophie is using people who have died and she either knew them or knew about them as her aliases. That's why she made comments about borrowing a stranger's grave and knowing their parents and first kiss. I think she actually went to go visit Sophie's grave at the end (not switch out since it's not same graveyard). It makes the whole burying that alias idea work. At first, I thought she was saying that she had made up their life stories, but then after thinking about it, I think she knew them.
Oh, and concerning Eliot's thing with the girl...yes, it was hot and sexy, but I hope it's not a permanent thing. It was a little more predictable than I was comfortable for in a storyline that doesn't cater to predictability. Now that everybody's all excited about his "handcuffs" and all...let's move on. I'm happy for him and all that, but I think there's so much more to him than that...
Loved the geek-guru show down...Go Hardison! You and Parker are my heroes!
Wow. That is about all I can say to sum up my feelings for this episode. The other crew was awesome, and I loved all the interactions! Especially the flashforwards. Are you going to make those pop up some time in the future, or was it a onetime deal? I also love how Chaos also had orange soda, and their little geek showdown, along with Eliot's scenes with the other hitter, especially when they were comparing scars, and the handcuff comment.
Congratulations on a 3rd season! I was so excited I was jumping up and down. We get more leverage awesomeness!
Quick question. I know you said on your twitter that the tombstone heading was changed on purpose. Can you tell us why, or is that a secret?
"But was it completely necessary to open the episode with Nate and Sophie conning an innocent secretary through the threat of sexual violence? "Your boss is a mass-murderer-slash-rapist, you're his type, and he's coming back tomorrow"? Really? REALLY? Way to advance the culture of rape in America."
I totally get where you're coming from. I'm a total feminist, and I'm all over politics of sexual power. I viewed that scene the exact opposite way you did, though. I view the entire Leverage show as a bit of a satire. I mean, most of the episodes are exposing white-collar crime that is generally downplayed in the news when tends to be even more destructive than "real" crimes like car theft. So I actually saw that dialogue as making fun of the intense fear of rape instilled in American women from a young age (despite the fact that the crime rate is pretty much going down, violent crime more so).
It all relates back to the extreme discomfort with and fear of sex that Americans tend to have. Check out news reports on "sexting" if you don't know what I'm talking about.
Also, I think it would be incredibly funny if, for a future job, Hardison's status as a Large Black Man was used to advance the con in some way. He could intimidate someone (because, despite how physically harmless Hardison is, most white people are afraid of black men deep down), or integrate himself into a group of blacks where white people wouldn't be easily accepted (gang, hip-hop culture, gangsta culture, ect.), or something. It'd be interesting to explore Hardison's "blackness" a bit (I know in my high school, computer classes are dominated by whites and asians). You could get some really funny situations with Hardison very out of his element. I trust you guys could pull it off without anything coming off coarse or racist.
Okay, I know I'm kind of shallow now, but I do think a girl's entitled. Christian, wet, tank top... Yum! As for the boys, I'm sure they all liked Noas cleveage. ;-)
I'll be short. Episode Rocked! So much to love .... too much to mention (but I did LOVE all the "Fantasy Fight" sequences - I think it worked really well to do it that way).
My question is: What does the License plate "186 KVE" on Nate's car signify? (if anything)
And in closing .. thanks for the .. well, I'll be blunt: Thanks for the Wet Christian Kane.
Marvelous episode. Best one yet, IMO. Loved the anti-team, especially Apollo and Noa Tishby. I'm crossing my fingers for a recurring role for her-she was absolutely stunning. Congratulations on a third season. And thank you for the wet Eliot.
Upon rewatching last night's episode I did come up with one question.
What was Noa saying during the Blockage team's briefing? I'm talking about that bit without the subtitles. I heard Elliot's name, but unfortunately my Hebrew is rusty (and by that I mean non-existent).
Also was it you or Amy who wrote the Jello/wiggle room line? Hilarious even the second time around.
In reply to those wondering about Sophie lifting the vase before dropping it, it seems only natural to want to lift the vase higher to give her more time to escape. Now you and I all know that in real world physics that extra foot and a half off of the ground is equivalent to milliseconds of actual time, but in TV physics that is practically hours. She probably could have grabbed a snack on the way out. And to those commenting on how she could have set it down once the pudding set, have you ever tried making instant pudding without a refrigerator? It isn't that solid I assure you.
Congrats again on a third season, I look forward to the inevitable fabulousness.
Where's the good in that? Threatening a woman with the possibility of sexual assualt is not funny. It's manipulative and downright nasty.
Where's the good in making making fun of the USA's habit of messing around in the politics of other countries? Where's the good in making fun of white-collar criminals getting laughably light sentences? Joking about something serious doesn't diminish the reality or magnitude of the problem, it just presents it to people in an easily digestible form.
The show makes jokes about violence all the time. "Did you just kill a guy with an appetizer?", the flashbacks about monkeys, ect. These are not presented in a satirical fashion, and have been easily accepted by the audience as far as I can tell.
This particular joke was about sexual violence. However, the humor of the joke came from the fact that the show was either making fun of the fact that serial killers are around every corner in television and movies or that women in the US are told to live in constant fear of rapists. Either way, the way I saw it, the joke depended on the viewer recognizing the way sexual violence, and particularly serial killings, are portrayed in the media and finding the absurdity in it.
So I actually saw that dialogue as making fun of the intense fear of rape instilled in American women from a young age.
Where's the good in that? Threatening a woman with the possibility of sexual assualt is not funny. It's manipulative and downright nasty.
Agreed--but I didn't read the scene that way, especially because they didn't say "your boss will be back tomorrow"; but "he's probably in Canada by now, and he won't be back".
It came across to me like they were trying to make her think he was a monster--so that when he does come back the next day, she'll call the real police--or at the very least, treat him with disgust. And *that* suits the team's idea of poetic justice for a guy who'd knowingly buy art stolen during the Holocaust and bribe a judge to dismiss the case brought by the legitimate owners.
And *that* suits the team's idea of poetic justice for a guy who'd knowingly buy art stolen during the Holocaust and bribe a judge to dismiss the case brought by the legitimate owners.
They weren't talking about him. They were talking about the guy that ran the office next door to him. Completely innocent.
Where's the good in that? Threatening a woman with the possibility of sexual assualt is not funny. It's manipulative and downright nasty.
Oh, and the team kind of makes their living on things that are manipulative and downright nasty. Off the top of my head
- Hardison had a flight attendant miss her flight in The Mile High Job. Parker then told at least on of her colleagues the woman was sleeping her way to the top. Both can be very damaging to the woman's career.
- Eliot hurts and kills people. A lot.
-Sophie has stolen several million dollars from the US government.
- Nate, before his son was killed, was probably a lot more like Sterling than he wants to admit and worked to keep people from getting money they needed from the insurance company to save the company money.
- Nate and the rest of the team convinced a man he was dying of a horrible contagious disease. That is some deep psychological trauma.
- Nate is rather sadistic.
- Hardison's criminal career is based on stealing money through the Internet and computer systems. Do you really think he only steals from 'bad' people? That man could have a crazy pyramid scheme going that your neighbors and grandma are both involved in.
- The team locked the CEO of the food company in The Top Hat Job in a small space for a long time. Don't tell me that man didn't get hurt when Eliot was slamming that box around the elevator.
Yes, the Leverage team are all likable characters, and they're the protagonists of the series. But they are not Good People. I see no reason why they would balk at threatening a woman with implications of sexual assault and murder. Well, Hardison (who balks at any kind of physical violence) and Eliot (who tends to have a very Southern, rather patriarchal attitude towards women) might not. None of the others would blink twice. Parker might smile as she says it.
great episode. Congrats to all for being picked up for a S3. Cant wait to see where ya'll will take us. I have to agree with all the other ladies, please more wet, tank top or wet shirtless Christian. The whole cast does an aweosme job and the writers are superb. I liked seeing Apollo, that was a nice add. He and Parker have some good chemistry there, would like to see where that leads.
"Two Live Crew" was GLEEFUL. I loved seeing Apollo as, well... Apollo. He and Beth were great. And Eliot and Mikel Dayan were HILARIOUS. I loved the "vintage" clips of them fighting, extrapolated solely from change in stance. It was a beautiful, hilarious gag. And the comparing scars at the end? Even better. I also adored the Nate and Sophie tag, tho I too was confused by the heastone. Then again, with vacation homes in India, Ireland, and Japan, I'm sure Sophie could afford a headstone if she chose to bury her past metaphorically and physically...
Bardic Lady: Marlowe and Archer are hardboiled detectives. Phillip Marlowe was played by Bogie in The Big Sleep. Miles Archer is Sam Spade's dead partner in Dashiell Hammett's The Maltese Falcon (and Spade was also played by Bogie). Both characters (along with another great noir detective, The Continental Op) appeared in Black Mask, a pulp mag, back in the day.
CindyD: I think probably the Maltese Falcon is more likely than Lew Archer? Only The Writers Know For Sure (and I'm sure Rogers will settle it, if we end up at pistols-at-dawn).
To All Assembled: If you haven't read Chandler, I highly recommend The Simple Art of Murder, which collects an essay and some Marlowe short stories/novellas, as a great place to start.
(I personally prefer Chandler over Hammett and Cain cos with the latter two, all the men are fools and all the women are evil and after a while you lose your faith in the idea of common human decency. Whereas Chandler's Phil Marlowe has a core of decency you never doubt--even when he's acting against it. Also, he gets beat up a lot. I measure my hardboiled detectives by how often and how well they can take a punch. And I include Honey West in there.)
Darkrose: Except they were sneaking into the office next door, so they could cut through the wall. For what it's worth? I never got "rapist" from the dialogue. I got "murder-you-and-feed-your-body-through-the-woodchipper". Not that that's necessarily better? But it is suitably over-the-top for it to be comedy, for me... Not that I am advocating the rape culture. Just calling it like I see it.
Yeah, that was my bad--I got confused as to who was where.
I still didn't read it as threatening rape, though--but it was a pretty nasty thing to do to the poor guy who's going to come back from his trip and discover that the receptionist thinks he's a serial killer.
Then again, as someone pointed out above, our team doesn't always worry about the collateral damage of their scams. They have a very ends justify the means attitude toward their jobs.
OK am I the only person here who watches classic Doctor Who? As soon as the Mona Lisa variant and five paintings showed up, I was rolling on the floor. Maybe this is because I recently watched City of Death ... the sticky note at the end was priceless.
Congratulations on getting renewed!
There have been Chandler aliases, there needs to be a Stout one, preferably with Timothy Hutton using one of them.
Oooh, I didn't even think of this until I read catchester's comment that Christian would get an ego boost if he were to read these posts. DOES everybody in the show read these posts? Actually, do they normally read what's being said about them and the show on other sites, as well?
We're so fortunate to get direct feedback from you. However, since we don't get the opportunity to hear from the cast members, it would be interesting to know if they actually read what their fans have to say. Or is the prospect so time-consuming that they have someone on staff breeze through "fan mail" in order to determine whether each comment should be placed and tallied in the positive, negative or in-between category, for instance?
Thanks for any insights you can share along these lines.
I still didn't read it as threatening rape, though--but it was a pretty nasty thing to do to the poor guy who's going to come back from his trip and discover that the receptionist thinks he's a serial killer.
I was assuming that based on the line about the nail polish, for some reason. Probably comes from watching too much "Criminal Minds." On that show, whenever a serial killer is taking an interest in how the victims look, 9 times out of 10, they're about to get raped.
Congratulations on the 3rd season! This gives me one less thing to fret about and one more thing to look forward to. I hope you realize that many of us would like, oh.....51 episodes, maybe? I know you have been saying you need rest so here is hoping you get some, recharge and come up with more brilliance for next season!
On the "The Three Days of the Hunter Job" you mentioned "Eliot, ironically, is the second best grifter after Sophie." Is this the evolution of the character? In past posts, and on the DVD commentaries, I thought you had hinted that this character isn't as good at the cons. Just curious.
Just to comment on some of the other comments - I don't think the team thinks of Eliot as all brawn and no brains. Well, okay, Nate thought he could only break heads in "The Wedding Job". I guess it is all in how one interprets a character. I always saw the character as a little deeper than that. Maybe not proficient at computers, at first, but maybe a man of deep thoughts but not a lot of words.
As for the DVD - it does indicate that it is close captioned but it doesn't seem to work independently. If your TV has close captioning, then it works. It really is a benefit since you can then get all the brillian and witty writing.
This week's episode was a favorite. The showdowns between each pairing of characters, both physically and mentally, was great. Great casting, great writing and great directing. I can see why you selected it to be the end of the summer season. I also appreciate that you aren't as big into cliffhangers. It is just enough to have to wait for the next season.
So funny when Eliot tried to cover up the handcuffs as Hardison walked by...to no avail. Hardison's smirk over the shoulder was hilarious.
The "flash forwards" were a great tool. The extremes and the film style made me think of Christian's Secondhand Lions scenes.
Lots of fun, great episode and YAYYAYYAY on S3. I propose 12 episodes in the summer, 12 in the winder. That will work for me. Shoot in Portland again if you can't come to Sacramento. At least you'll be on the right coast for Kane shows.
Are we going to get the eyecatches (the brief promos during commercial breaks or bracketing episodes where the cast members stare into the camera as it spins around and some guy talks in a deep voice) on the next DVD set?
Was Parker's idea about the secret Nazis a nod to her sudden interest in conspiracy theories after the Three Days of Hunter job? Cause no conspiracy wall is complete without some mention of the secret Nazi lizard men living at the center of the world.
Best episode this season yet, hands down, bar none. So glad you guys have a third season coming. Hoping you make it to lucky number seven.
1) Can we see more of Noa Tisby? (And by "see more" I mean that I think she and Eliot having an off-again, on-again relationship would be spectacular... Although, seeing her wet and shirtless WAS definitely eye candy...)
2) Does Hardison have a hacker name, or is that too "script kiddie" for him?
3) When, vaguely, will Season 3 start airing? I know you can't give me hard'n'fast dates (but if you can, that's impressive) but early next year? Mid next year? Beginning of next year? Or can we just have Leverage on once a week from now until everyone in the cast'n'crew is completely spent, say, 5-7 years from now?
You can thank Wil for my wife and I watching the show. We had not heard of it until I saw Wil mention it on his blog. TNT happened to be running the pilot so we watched it, and were hooked. We loved "The Two Live Crew Job" We would love to see our crew and the Anti-crew work together ( reluctantly of course) on a job!
We loved the Star Trek reference in the one scene where Aldis mentions Kobiashi Maru, and the only one who recognizes it's from Star Trek is Beth.
Loved the episode. I actually thought the Top Hat Job was more of a 'squeeze' episode (where the team has to overcome obstacles that derail their initial plan) rather than a 'breeze' episode (where the reveals at the end show the team had it all going to plan the entire time). I prefer breeze episodes but I understand there needs to be both kinds.
I guess that leads to a question. Do you start out knowing what type an episode is, or is it something that comes out as you write?
Cei said: "*inches past the psycho-rant-person two posts up* Yeah... take your meds."
That was uncalled for -- you must be lucky enough not to have been raped or had someone in your life who was raped OR unfairly accused of rape. Many folks who have been unfortunate enough are NOT on meds and certainly are not nuts.
That said, great ep that clearly rises to the best level of season 1.
What I've noticed this season is that up until this ep, I haven't enjoyed the eps as much -- until I've seen them uninterupted by commercials online.
This one, I've seen both ways and enjoyed it just as much.
@Tara Yes, I was already aware of all that (especially since Lew's name is known to be a homage to Hammett's Archer) but I hardly think pistols at dawn will be necessary! As I stated, these were merely my personal hopes, not an answer that I be presumptive enough to think I know. Just spreading the Lew love while saving any Hammett love for the Leverage finale "The Maltese Falcon Job". Is that me quivering with anticipation? Why, yes, it is!
Two things: The Flash forwards on the fights. Okay, Who do you think out of the trio of Rogers, Berg and Devlin is the old school Shaw Bros fan? My money is on Rogers.
Two. The Chaos spinoff. Will the robots be old school Robby like tin cans or will they be sexy fembots who Chaos must teach how to love? The Skeezy old perv in me would prefer the latter but given Mr. Wheaton's very happy marriage, I will forgive you if you go with the former.
Oh man, I am two episodes behind but I made a point of watching the Wheaton episode.
You and Amy had Too Much Fun on that one. The Elliot vs woman scenes were absolute classics!!
And of course you had to call Wheaton "Chaos." I read his blog post several months ago too. You missed an opportunity there, however. Hardison: "Yeah, he's called 'Chaos' but dig it, the man is weird. He calls himself 'Chows'."
1. I figured she'd just found a real "Sophie Deveraux" in the cemetary at the end -- maybe the one she'd based her persona on. But the tombstone thing did throw me at first.
2. Considering that the whole episode pivoted on Sophie's identity crisis, I thought (and really liked the notion) that Sophie was her OWN evil twin -- that the reformed, improved person she'd become was battling the "Sophie Devereaux" she used to be.
I'll also second Tara's recommendation of "The Simple Art of Murder," which includes my all-time favorite Chandler story, "Pearls Are a Nuisance," in which the author turns all his staple elements upside-down, makes hilarious fun of his own style, and still turns out a terrific tale.
Please tell the TNT humans responsible for the Leverage Facebook page that abusing their "put content on my wall" power for cross-promotion is not making them any friends.
FWIW, USA had this problem a couple months ago. They got some angry email after pimping their pro wrestling franchise via the Burn Notice page. Apparently nobody at the networks has been paying attention, and they think that this whole "social networking" thing is just an opt-in advertising channel. Welcome to 2009, guys...
Congrats on getting a third season. This season has been great but this one and 'The Tap Out Job' are my favorites so far.
I don't try to think about it too much and just go with it. But I'm still not sure how or when the comms work.
Do the others hear both sides when Nate and later Sophie talk to Stark? And related to that if they do how does that work when Stark isn't wearing one (at least not from Nate's team)?
And do they hear everything that's said by any member of the team? Eliot's "what's with all the uh-oh's" would suggest they do. But when Sophie and Hardison talk in the van or her and Nate chat about Emily is that private or are the rest listening?
Sometimes there are two or more conversations going on at the same time and Eliot is fighting. I'd think all that chatter would be annoying and worse distracting.
This episode was perfection. I loved everything single moment. The Eliot fight kicked ass and i thought they were done for until Sophie came out... it was great.
I wanted to ask.. will we be finding out about Sophie's persona's?
Also, this question is about The Order 23 Job. I noticed how much focus Eliot lost on the job when he saw the little kid and i was wondering, did that happened to him as he was growing up? Is that why he ended up getting recruited or going into the forces or ops?
I'd really love to know more of his back story. Him and Parker are the ones that really seem alike in that their pants are a complete mystery.
I'm not gonna engage with folks over whether rape jokes are hilarious and funny, or get into why "jokes where the US and its foreign policy are the target" aren't quite the same as "jokes where women who fear rape are the target." But I do want to respond to darkrose, who said:
Agreed--but I didn't read the scene that way, especially because they didn't say "your boss will be back tomorrow"; but "he's probably in Canada by now, and he won't be back".
They say that he won't be back, but he will - as someone pointed out upthread, the guy they're talking about isn't the guy who bought the Nazi-stolen art. He'll come in the next day, and the secretary will think he wants to rape and kill her. And even if the boss were the guy who bought the Nazi-stolen art, making the secretary afraid of potential sexual violence in order to get back at someone is using her in a kind of horrifying way.
The combination of "you, young blonde secretary, are this serial killer's type" and "has he ever expressed interest in your toenail polish" make it a joke about sexual predators; the discourse on serial killers is a discourse about men hunting women, and it is inevitably sexualized. The threat that Nate and Sophie deliver is a threat of rape and murder, and to pretend otherwise is facile. Now, if you want to defend that action based on the fact that these characters have, in the past, broken the law in order to save orphans or beaten up, like, mafia hitmen, then I guess that's your prerogative.
@Robinyj and others who inquired about why Sophie didn't just set the vase down...
1) Because if someone sends you a bomb, of COURSE you want them to think it worked and you're dead, in order to smoke them out in relative safety. They probably knew/assumed the bomb-sender was watching the apartment too - hence, the bomb having to blow up ASAP. Which leads me to...
2) For the sake of argument, they probably wanted it to blow up as quickly as possible to avoid suspicion of a fake death.
3) And if we go with the "team predicts everything in advance" concept - they also wanted it to blow up because they were planning to use Sophie's death in the con as of the moment they knew a bomb had been sent to her.
I dunno. I grew up with the feminist movement and work in a community of women that is focused on women's issues (and am a women myself) and I sure didn't infer the threats of sexual violence and potential murder in the nail polish and wood chipper scene. I did conclude the detectives were trying to freak the girl out by suggesting her boss had some peculiar proclivities, but sexual violence is a stretch.
Unless Hardison is sneaking carrot-pills into Eliot's food, please have someone check makeup.
There's been 3 Orange Eliot and 2 Orange Sophie episodes. It's always in the 'happy yellow' lighted scenes (meaning I get distracted from competence porn and banter, my fave parts). Only Eliot and/or Sophie. Fix it, Mr. Rogers. I need my porn!
Just a general comment, that it's strange how people view things so differently.
The cop/receptionist scene didn't ring any alarm bells with me, a life long feminist.
What I have noticed is the fact that the only two kisses we've seen Eliot have, he's physically restrained the woman. I don't think consent was an issue with either kiss though, which is why i haven't come here raging and screaming "NO MEANS NO! I expect better of you, you evol agents of the patriarchy!"
And at the end of the day, Leverage is a TV show, not an advert for Women's Lib.
While Eliot's two kisses have been with "restrained" women, if you remember Aimee pinned him to the wall first in the Two HOrse Job and Miss Massaud was trying to hurt him so he either could have hit her or kissed her. I like his way.
The threat that Nate and Sophie deliver is a threat of rape and murder, and to pretend otherwise is facile.
I'm sorry that my comment about reading the scene differently came across as trying to pretend it was something else.
Now, if you want to defend that action based on the fact that these characters have, in the past, broken the law in order to save orphans or beaten up, like, mafia hitmen, then I guess that's your prerogative.
I wasn't saying that at all. I was pointing out that these characters have, in the course of saving orphans and scamming hitmen, taken actions that may have caused harm to innocent bystanders, and that they clearly consider that acceptable collateral damage. They are the good guys, but that doesn't mean they're always right.
OK am I the only person here who watches classic Doctor Who?
No. I was all over that too.
And as long as people are making wishlists for British actors to appear on the show, how about some of Gina's cohorts from Coupling making an appearance?
Regarding Parker's Laser Escapade: I'm guessing the Lasers were a visual effect, and not a practical one... in the commentary for the First David Job one of you mentioned it's tricky to make them visible.
Well, if they were a visual effect, then bravo to your effects team. They had the lasers reflecting in Parker's eyes. Going the extra mile.
>>>And as long as people are making wishlists for British actors to appear on the show, how about some of Gina's cohorts from Coupling making an appearance?
Heh-heh. I am evil. I request the guy who looked like Dennis Potter from Karaoke to appear. Alas, Gina would not think that funny. But I did warn I was being evil!
What I have noticed is the fact that the only two kisses we've seen Eliot have, he's physically restrained the woman.
Well, Aimee then shoved him against a wall and kissed him again. And Mossad woman could have stomped his foot or something if she was angry about it.
Eliot has also flirted with other many other women on-screen without any context of violence, and the show implies that he has the most active sex life out of any of the Leverage team.
I think the whole 'restrain the woman' thing just comes from the fact that Eliot's fighting ability and strength are two big parts to his over-all attractiveness. So if Eliot's in a romantic scene, in which his attractiveness is being played up, the show needs some way to show off his muscles, and its not like there're more than two people around.
I want to second what was mentioned a few posts up: Where did Nate's Tesla go? I loved the Tesla.
This could be my favorite episode yet. You put a post-it note on my favorite Van Gogh, though. I may have cringed in horror, and I'm not even an art person. I have a feeling that the post-it adhesive would do something horrible to the paint and cause Van Gogh scholars worldwide to faint dead away.
Other than that, this episode was made of win. Bravo. And congrats on the renewal! There was much rejoicing in my office.
complete left field comment- just rewatching your Comedy Now Stand up on the comedynetwork.ca website...I saw this when it originally aired and I always loved it. Use to catch it in reruns whenever I could. Now thanks to the net I can finally tell you :) ain't technology grand. I know you're now a kick ass writer- but I loved your stand up :)
What was the Mussad chick saying during the reverse briefing on Nate? cause it was kinda awesome that Apollo knew who he was and i would love it if even she was a bit leery of him
I've now seen it twice. "Top Hat Job" was a disappointment for me, while this episode knocked it out of the park. Tight writing, a great premise, fun acting, an actual theft and few plot holes -- everything I could ask for.
I'll take a second and remark on how Sophie's character arc is naturally leading her to leave the group for a while -- thus clearing the way for Gina's pregnancy. It isn't feeling forced, and that's a tribute to the writers. Not easy at all.
OK, the past few episodes had me worried. They just weren't up to par of the first season. No worries now. "The Two Live Crew Job" is my favorite show to date. Great job!
That was the praise now some critiques/suggestions.
Make the new crew re-occurring either opposing or allies.
Have Will back as a re-occurring nemesis. Have Noa Tishby back period!
Hardison's needs to tone it back a bit. My family has started a game of stating where he goes too far. Like when talking with the guards " your the red in my red cross" - too far. Priest in the vault of the bank "You're the twinkle in Twinkle little start" - Way to far. Otherwise I love the character.
Hardison's needs to tone it back a bit. My family has started a game of stating where he goes too far. Like when talking with the guards " your the red in my red cross" - too far. Priest in the vault of the bank "You're the twinkle in Twinkle little start" - Way to far. Otherwise I love the character.
I'm pretty sure he's meant to be going too far. Hardison's specialty is computer crimes. He sits in a room by himself and presses buttons to make things happen. He's pretty much entirely new to grifting.
Considering that, he does amazingly well, particularly in the Juror #6 Job, but I think part of the reason he manages to pull off an in-person con is that he always goes over-the-top with this incredibly exuberant confidence. Hardison doesn't give people room to question his sincerity when he's grifting; his characters are so intense the marks think there's no way someone could be making this personality up. Kind of like how Nate's characters are always incredibly huge assholes or out-of-their-mind drunk. Being super-intense shifts the mark's frame of reference so they never think to compare the grifter to how a normal, non-con artist person would be behaving.
I must have been watching another show because the Leverage I watched was basically another silly episode put out by the writers that have taken this show so far from its roots it's terrible in comparison. The way I see it there are one of several situations in play here, a couple immediately come to mind...1) The writers are different and have taken the show off course 2) the producers have decided to try to expand the fan base by changing the show instead of giving the audience a chance to find it. Either way it's definitely a "dumbed-up" version of its original self. I hope it finds its way back because it was a fantastic show.
Anonymous said ... I'm pretty sure he's meant to be going too far. Hardison's specialty is computer crimes. He sits in a room by himself and presses buttons to make things happen. He's pretty much entirely new to grifting.
Yeah I think you're on the mark. He's so good in the van and with the briefings. I think Juror #6 showed his promise so I would think the over the top scene would have Sophia coaching him when he pushes it. Like when they call Parker on her "differences". Still a great show.
Did the team actually Send Chaos the real painting? I saw that when they opened the box there was a sticky note that said "This is the real one!" But I guess I can't see them letting go a priceless work of art. Or have they really all evolved so much that they don't even think twice about it?
I fully admit I have not read the thread; on the other hand I'm still watching the episode. What I want to know is: did anyone in the writers' room utter the phrase "Earth-2 Leverage Team?" 'Cuz that's what we have here, and it is AWESOME.
Also, it was twittered (....maybe?) that Christian's forehead/eyebrow wound was the reason he wore a hat in the Two Live Crew episode, but looking at screencaps of The Top Hat Job, in the beginning he has a hat and a bandana over what looks like a gauzy bandage thing, so were these shot out of order?
Please, please, pleeeeeeeease bring back Apollo!!! I loved watching him and Parker squaring off. Everybody was awesome!! (Fangirly squeeage is fangirly)
Great Episode and congrats on Season 3! Wil W was wonderful.
I have been rewatching Season 1 after reading some posts from other viewers in order to get more up to speed.
I have a quick question for you.
While I am a fan of Christian with long hair, it seems to really be getting so long it is in his way more. Does it affect filming at all? I mean - how can you fight when you can't see!
It seemed more practical at somewhere in between pilot and now.
Thanks and thank you for taking the time to respond to everyone.
Jensen probably wouldn't have time. V.V. busy having his own legion of screaming fans on Supernatural. Check out buddyTV, he's been No.1 on there for AGES, sadly beating Christian Kane by a mile. Would be very awesome though, or David Boreanaz. Should get Christian to pull some strings, lol.
Loved the ep. I'd read all the comments but I just don't have the time. I definately was getting very excited in the very tense fight scene. I can't wait for more Leverage. Kudos on a 3rd season!
@Tara: I don't know if I'd classify Marlowe as hard boiled Chandler typically had a softer touch than Spillane. I'd say Robert Mitchum is the quintessential Marlowe though.
As for the episode, how much does it cost(in general) to make an episode of LEVERAGE? I mean without the marketing push, just actors,writers, sets, and crew.
On that note, will we ever get a small Coupling reference in the show? Or will it be like the Kane/Anderson wink in The Snow Job - considered but never shown?
Another amazing episode! Quick question -- since Nate runs the nastiest crew *this* side of the Atlantic, any chance you bring on the cast of Hustle so they can take on the toughest crew on the other side of the pond?
I count at three homage to Star Trek with Wil, Kobyoshi Maru and Noa.
These last episodes have been stellar. The glimpses of Eliot are cracking me up. Keep up the excellent work. Congrats on another season.
By the way, I only knew you from JonRog's story hour. I knew what you did, but I had not connected you with the series until this season. It is cool as heck I liked it so much then found out it was you.
More congrats on the renewal! I love that smart shows written by smart people get recognition occassionally.
And now for a question that is pure character development pron:
Chaos tells Stark that everyone was always more afraid of Sophie than of him. Afraid? I can see respecting her more than him, but afraid? Was this a deliberate word choice, and if so, why?
You once wrote that "rain is cheap night." Taking some guests from out of town on the WB studio tour, I mentioned this remark to them...and then we couldn't figure it out. I suppose night shoots must be more expensive because, I dunno, it's time and a half for the crew or something? But can rain really pass for night?
And while I'm on the subject of questions about TV production in general and not about your show in particular, how many morgues are there? Is there just one morgue on someone's lot and everyone rents it to do their shoots there? Cuz come to think of it, they all look exactly the same, with the same rows of square stainless steel doors, always shot from the same angle, with that same door to the left.
Is it just me or has the series gotten new writers (or lost old ones?) I've watch two episodes from the new season and they definitely seem to be not as well written as the first season. There's way too much joking around now (especially the one where they were competing against another crew of thieves).
@Sean; See, to me, Chandler, Hammett, and Cain defined "hardboiled detective fiction" as a genre back in the 1920s and 1930s, whereas I think of Spillane as 2nd generation hardboiled. Mike Hammer is to Marlowe and Sam Spade to me what the 21st century Bourne films are to the 20th century Bond films, if that makes sense? Almost a meta-reflection of the earlier archetypes, with certain aspects (sex and violence in particular) exaggerated and refined to suit a new and changed post-WWII audience. And Fickling's "Honey West" and Gregory MacDonald's "Fletch" do the same in the 1960s and 1970s.
Erm... sorry! That got kinda wanky. I AM A GEEK, OKAY? But definitely Chandler's work isn't quite as bleak as Hammett and Cain's, and Marlowe is a more sympathetic and empathetic protagonist by far than, say, the Continental Op.
If the bomb was motion activated, then how did Sophie pick it up and walk that far into her apartment with out it going off? And she wasn't that far away from bomb when it went off and the resulting explosion blew out all the windows but she was ok?
261 comments:
1 – 200 of 261 Newer› Newest»The most obvious question that springs to my mind is this: if our Team was able to break into the Anti-Team's hideout to steal the forgeries, why didn't they just steal the first painting (and use the theft at the gallery merely as a distraction)? Well, aside from the fact that that would have made for a VERY short episode, of course.
Will we be seeing Chaos again? In less than 10-20 I mean. Seems like a fun guy to bring back.
So Hardison's little 'Yall's nasty" comment .. was that improv or scripted.
Fantastic ep.. just the editing of the 2 crews, the competition and then the ending with Sophie and Nate, so much sweet with with sour - awesome over all.
As much of a great mid season finale it is, I am happy we get 2 more eps.
Thanks for all you do.
I hope the cast and crew know how much love there is for the show. :) My twitter stream seemed to be almost all #leverage all night.
Questions for this ep... Hmm...
Are we meant to infer that Eliot and Noa Tisby's character have a fling immediately following the episode?
I know I recognize Marlowe and Archer as names from something, but I can't place it right now, can you assist?
How on earth is Parker going to deal with Sophie coming back and not going by Sophie anymore? Playing dead was bad enough...
When do we find out about a hypothetical season 3? And if there were to be such a thing, would it be shot in Portland? Y'all seem to really love it there.
Thanks to you and Mr. Devlin and Berg and the whole ensemble. Great show. I've now added my cousin to the list of people I've hooked...
I apologize if the question has been asked before, but is Eliot's name a nod to "Hellraiser"?
This episode rocked my socks off. I was expecting a lot of good, with both Apollo and Wheaton guest starring, and the entire premise, and you far exceeded my expectations. How it is you keep managing to bring the awesome, I don't know. But kudos, sir, to you and yours on what is now my favorite episode to date.
My two questions are these, do you plan (vaguely or specifically) to bring any of the "evil" team back in the future (either as allies or as opposition), and is there going to be a time jump between 207 and 208?
The fighting! In the heads! That's so absolutely perfect.
Though when I do it I don't later end up wet and chained to my opponent, so apparently I'm picking my opponents poorly. But I would spar Eliot. Once, maybe.
Great casting for this show, lovely to see Apollo onscreen, Noa Tishby's a find and a half--built like a woman who can take a hit and handle heavy ordnance and a hottie to boot.
The first time they hit the auction house, what was Eliot's job? Apart from fate getting him where he needed to be?
Loved loved loved the episode. Wil Wheaton makes a great geeky bad guy.
I did like how the wound on Christian's temple was worked into the fight. That was perfect. Was the fight scene filmed before or after he pulled his own stitches out?
I am a big fan of the show.
I think having semi-regular antagonists would be good for the show.
This evil version of the team would be awesome.
First I must say that this is my absolute favorite episode to date. I laughed hysterically when Apollo and Parker had the show down when they were doing recon as waiters. Brilliant. It was brilliant how each character got to meet what was essentially their evil twin. Im still giddy.
As for my questions. Will the other team be coming back at some point? I liked the whole fighting over the prize to see who is the best of the best scenerio.
Also, I just wanted to know if you realized the amount of screaming coming from fangirls across America during Chris' fight scene. I think I heard echoes...
Hats off to you and the entire crew. This was an amazing episode, WELL deserving of all the hype and build-up. This is definitely my favorite episode this season.
I've only got one question. Was it my imagination, or did Parker honestly show the slightest, tiniest bit of sadness during Sophie's eulogy? Well, right before she was creeped out by the whole death act.
Keep up the awesome job, guys. The episodes you've been punching out are nothing short of brilliant, and it's no surprise Leverage has become my favorite show on TV.
Best ep this season (in my humble opinion). Where'd you get the idea for the pudding, though? Also, I'm noticing more and more Parker/Eliot interactions - to slow the Parker/Hardison arc, or is it something more?
First off, thank you for not doing what I think you were gonna do!
NOw on to the question, I have noticed in flashbacks we always see "lil Parker" Will we see any Lil other team members?
you know, How grumpy was Lil Eliot, Lil Hardison the first time he worked a keyboard or even Lil Nate and the time he lead his entire school in taking back his school as it was about to be foreclosed, Oh wait wrong Nate....
Also a SOundtrack for Leverage, We can Haz?
Did Noa do her own stunts/actually fight with Chris in the scenes? You definitely should work her into more story-lines. How could Eliot resist a woman that can hold her own against him and has a good chance to kick his butt? Maybe work the fling into some episodes next season? (crossing fingers)
Also I think having Apollo in the show more often would be an awesome addition. Love the guy! I think him and Parker would make a great couple.
Oh, and of course I loved today's episode. You all are doing a fantastic job.
When Chaos gets a spin-off, how many robots will live with him in his apartment?
Given the lack of honor amongst thieves from Chaos, after getting caught wouldn't he rat everyone out for a reduced sentence?
Great Episode.. Please bring Chaos back again.. Loved the Kobayashi Maru Reference.. Keep up the great work!
Excellent as usual. It wasn't *all* from Wil's electric sexuality, but hey, use whatcha got.
Ilex and I had one of those questions that seems silly to ask (but clearly that's not stopping me): When we see Sophie's tombstone the first time, it says Katherine, and the second time, it says Sophie. Are we meant to understand that she had it changed? (Other options include her having faked her own death before, although this did seem like a new grave...) -- or is it a more mundane explanation?
@Bardic Lady
Although the aliases are supposed to be from some film that echos the con, I'm hoping the aliases are from Raymond Chandler's Philip Marlowe and Ross Macdonald's Lew Archer. Both fictional detectives frequently ended up helping people they didn't necessarily like because they didn't seem to have much choice in the matter. Both are also known for having pity and compassion for sad people in bad situations.
But I'd like an answer to that alias question as well, please.
Wonderful episode, BTW. It lived up to all the hype and more! And kudos for making Wil the "really" bad guy. I actually did not see it coming and that is rare, for me, and totally FUN!
As I have watched it only three times so far, I 'm sure I'll have more questions once I am finished watching it. This could, however, take several days...
@Wil Wheaton
Only two. But Howard and Rajesh will continue to visit, as usual.
Brilliant episode. As I said to Dean, the editing of the two teams near the end of act 2 (or was it 3? Dad called in the middle so I couldn't keep track) was quite well done. I love techniques like that.
You and Amy already answered my quibble about the tombstone. It just didn't seem clear in the episode that SHE was the one who changed the tombstone. But as Sophie is on the tombstone, will she still be called Sophie by the group? I'd assume so, it's all they've ever known, but it will be interesting. And I do wonder if this Katherine is her real name. We've been hinted at it before, but to choose Katherine twice has to mean something.
Another thing I'm curious about is the woman that bumped into Starke near the end of the episode. Will we be seeing her again? I think I've seen her before, but I'm just not sure where... Can you help?
Finally, inspired choices for the aliases. Marlowe for Philip Marlowe, am I right?
Oh wait, there was one more thing: I've always been intrigued by the Holocaust (for numerous reasons), so thanks for making that a part of the episode :)
So glad we get another episode next week as if the fact that I had two new episodes tonight (since I was on vacation last week) wasn't amazing enough!
PS. Since I've delayed enough on posting this comment, let me (be hopefully the first to) say CONGRATS ON A THIRD SEASON!!
Awesome, awesome episode.
Anything I say would basically be a rehashing of things already said, but I just wanted to make known that I am in full support of a Chaos return/robot spin-off.
Also, major kudos for casting a woman who looks like she actually consumes food on a regular basis. And on top of that, is a totally smokin' ass kicker. Very refreshing.
Speaking of casting, (see what I did there? I'm so clever) how did the casting of the rival crew go? I already know some details via Wil's blog about his character, but let's hear your side of it and more about the other three.
Just heard! CONGRATS on Leverage being renewed for Season 3!!!!!
As everyone else said, FANTASTIC episode. I was squeefully excited about it all week, and it lived up to what I'd been anticipating.
Chaos rocks. I envy the hell out of Noa Tisby. Lucky wench.
I'm simply looking forward to the rest of the season.
My one question is probably one that won't be answered. Just how many alternate identities does "Sophie" have?
Were you going for a record for film ho-mages?
Never mind Chaos (who I'm entirely confident we'll see again), let's see Apollo again. A star is born!
favorite episode so far! congrats on a 3rd season! i can't wait :D
i love the female ass kicker and her tough chick vibe.
did you work chris's head wound into the fight or was it scripted that way originally?
is the scar he showed on his arm real b/c if it isn't major congrats, it looks totally real.
Loved, LOVED the episode! Definitely the best so far. The Other Crew was just as awesome as Our Crew and for favourite scene I seriously can't decide between the first non-fight between Eliot and the Mossad lady (just fabulous how they saw all the moves in their heads)and Parker/Apollo "crossroads" discussion about birds... You guys are the best!
And please confirm those third season news are true...
I see Season Three is a go! That's great news!
The "fighting in their heads" reminds me of Midnighter from THE AUTHORITY. I see you co-wrote, John (at least according to one site!), so -- deliberate homage, or just clever way to get out of the inevitable damage they'd cause fighting each other in that antiquities room? Either way, it was awesome to see, and unique for TV.
As was Miss Tishby in her role. Was the idea to try to dodge some of the "Hollywood Hardcase" tropes? Having her be ex-Mossad who actually spoke mostly Hebrew, even in casual conversation, was impressive, as was having someone who wasn't rail-thin.
And Wil. Bring Back Will. I know that's not a question, but hey. You've said it's hard finding plots that Hardison can't code out of in 20 minutes; seeing Chaos wreak the team in that fashion would be interesting...
oy, the scene was extremely slow today, only now does eztv deliver ..
anyway, am very much looking forward to tonights viewing ..
Loved Parker's funeral dress. Thank you so much for having her realize that the one thing a funeral really needs is a little sex appeal.
Also, Sophie's real name. Either it's something embarrassing like Gretyl von Stoolface or it's Jack Higgins meaning she's the result of the most awesome sex change operation in history. Which is it?
Oh, and bring Wil Wheaton back even if you have to meet his outrageous salary demands.
Awesome, awesome episode. this episode would seem to be the perfect bookend to season 2a, with the "burial" of the Sophie identity at the end of the show, as well as the reappearance of the Nate/Sophie relationship, but I'll take any extra Leverage ya got, since I'll have to wait months after the two-parter until we get new Leverage.
comments and questions, all intermingled:
- love the casting of Wil Wheaton and the Kobayashi Maru reference on the Leverage universe's version of "Mirror, Mirror" - one of the best Trek TOS episodes. You should have gotten Wil to make his facial hair into the Mirror Spock evil goatee. :)
- So if Marcus didn't send Sophie the bomb, why was he so sure at the funeral that it wasn't an accident? And if he was, wouldn't he have been trying to find out who killed her?
- who were all the attendees at the fake funeral? people paid by Nate to show up? or were they friends with Sophie as "Katherine" (assuming that's the identity that she used to purchase/rent her place that was blown up)
- The mental fight between Christian and Noa's characters: love the idea of something different from the conventional fight scene. Homage to the Jet Li-Donnie Yen mental fight in Hero? Although my first thought was of my favorite Warren Ellis character: The Midnighter from the Authority, he with the unique superpower of envisioning any fight before it starts.
- was interesting to see how the Leverage gang was viewed by former compatriots of the underworld, as explained by Marcus. The nastiest crew this side of the Atlantic? So ironically, even though they've turned to do good, their criminal reputations are still being burnished by the jobs they're doing.
- LOVED the scene at the bar with the two groups hanging out at the end with the competitiveness (Beth/Apollo) and the comparisons (Christian/Noa). Its the super-team trope of pitting two groups against each other and having them be buddy/buddy at the end. Just more opportunity for Competence porn! (which I admit to being a big fan of)
Congratulations on being renewed for Season 3!
Very good ep! Not sure how sexy, but wil's character really seemed to gel with the others, oddly enough. Bring him back in a pardon/partnership ep. Soon!
Could we just leave Christian in a tank top and wet hair for the whole next season.....way to go on season 3....I cannot wait...
Awesome episode indeed! My wife and I were both on the edge of our seats and her smile was quite adorable. Kudos on a totally excellent episode.
Congrats on Season 3! Are you fine folks coming back to Portland for the next season?
A good episode! Lots of really great parts (the high noon showdown, especially was awesome).
The story seemed to come to a resolution really quickly in the final part. Like that they noticed the time, and wrapped up everything really quickly. Maybe a 2 parter would have been good for this.
When I first heard of the Blockage team, I thought they'd be a little more..evil..conning wrong what was once conned right....perhaps there's a truly evil team still out there......
The initial face off between Eliot and Noa Tisby. There's a story of Miyamoto Musashi meeting a samurai on a small bridge. They each drew their swords, locked eyes, then seethed their swords and walked away, realizing they were equals and one would never beat the other (Claremont would tell this story with every other Wolverine tale he did). I was wondering if the "flash forwards" was a reference to that.
And speaking of Noa Tisby's character....where can I find a nice Jewish girl like that? (and does she like beagles?)
To Bardic Lady: Fling? I fully suspect Eliot and Noa had one-night-only break-the-bed, wreck-the-room, send-the-neighbors-running-for-cover S-E-X.
Laughed aloud at the "shootout" between Hardison and Kaos only because Aldis Hodge could break Wil Wheaton into messy pieces.
You have been making me very happy so far with Kane in boxers and sweat in 2.02 and now sweat and black wife-beater; still waiting for a swimming pool and speedo.
Any chance of snagging that fellow from Vancouver who was singing with Aldis at Chris' birthday show as a guest star? What's his name, Jorden, Johnson, something like that?
So you have Eliot almost misspeak at the funeral by saying "Soph... so much, Catherine" – but then on the headstone it says Sophie Deveraux? Come on!
Awesome awesome episode! Any chance you bring Apollo and Will back for more?
I've got one thing that confuses me, though: They are supposed to bury Katherine, right? So why is Sophie's name written on the tombstone?
Congrats on the renewal! Best news ever. Leverage is brilliant!
to Ruth The guy in Vancouver is Jensen Ackles
The "evil" counterparts are saved, Stark gets a taste of being a good guy, Chaos turns out to be REALLY evil -- overall just a lot of great twists and turns and resolutions that were very satisfying and that I did not expect.
There were lots of little moments (like the geek shoot out!) that stand out, but one of the nicest was the interaction between Beth Riesgraf and Apollo Robbins, especially in the air duct. They play off of each other so well.
Oh, I do want to mention the scene at the end between Nate and Sophie, too. Beautiful and sad.
Oops, nevermind the tombstome question. Different cemetery...
Things i dug:
WIL~!
Stark being a grump about doing the right thing (even though it was just a trade for the "Van Gogh"). Shows that it still takes a special kind of thief to be Robin Hood
WHEATON~!
Sophie's scene with Hardison in the van - "That's the smell of hard work"
I'm not even going to ask the "Can a few cranks on a generator power the equipment", that's how much I trust this show.
Somewhere between fanfic and a spec script, there must be a happy medium, because I keep thinking of things I'd like to see the Leverage crew do, but I am not yet a full-fledged writer. Awaiting that blog post
Congrats on Season Three!
I really hope this isn't the end of the Blockage (nice one Video_Beagle) team...since Stark would be well-suited as Sophie's counterpart, maybe Sterling has his team to take down Nate? Hmmmm?
Great episode. But wasn't it "Katherine" that they buried? Nate's comment to his evil twin seemed to say as much. And if so, why did the tombstone say "Sophie Devereaux" at the end?
And yeah, I realize I just became the "I Grok for Spock" guy.
For all you people who are bewildered by the Sophie/Katherine headstone thing... Refer to @Gaby's comment...
You and Amy already answered my quibble about the tombstone. It just didn't seem clear in the episode that SHE was the one who changed the tombstone.
Oh man, this one was so good.
Questions about the imagined fight scenes, because the concept was cool but the execution was too amazing for words: Whose idea was it to do the scratched film effect on those? Did that come straight from Amy's script?
I really enjoyed this episode - I like the almost friendly rivalry between Parker and her counterpart and Eliot...well, thanks for that scene, that's all I have to say.
That 'evil' team is too good not to bring back eventually, so add my vote to doing that when you can.
I would like to know what the old couple will do with the painting - technically it is still stolen so do you have a Word of God as to how they dealt with that?
And finally - general question - I'd like to know if you have a fantasy script in your head in which David Tennant stars, and if so what would he be doing?
Why did Parker have such a hard time adjusting to Sophie's faked death? Also, will we see more development in Parker and Hardison's relationship?
I have to ask....what is the star trek connection? Directors and actors?
Loved the Boston skyline shot and Sophie's better attempt at sounding Bostonian....didn't need the Reveah Claw or Meffa big hair for that one.
Loved this episode.....my favorite so far.....hoping we'll see some of those characters come back in the future.
Kelly
No questions about the episode. I just wanted to CONGRATULATE YOU ON GETTING THE THIRD SEASON!
So everybody had an 'evil' twin on the other team except for poor, dead Sophie. Any chance we'll ever see Lindsay Price as her opposite number someday?
Was that Wil Wheaton's real facial hair, or did the makeup team have to work on it? How much of the show's budget did it account for?
Seriously, I recognized the foil from Jon's Twit pic a few months ago. Would never have guessed it was instant pudding!
Awesome episode. Lots of re-watch value, which will be important as I while away the fall months until the show's return.
First, if Sophie could lift the vase/bomb over her head after the pudding was added, what was preventing her from slowly putting it on the ground and walking away?
Second, if Sophie had died in an explosion, there wouldn't have been an open casket! She would have been pink mist.
And if "Catherine" was being buried, then why did the tomb stone say Sophie Devereaux?
Loved the two teams, especially because for awhile there it seemed like our crew might be the only high-rate criminals in the world. Nice seeing that their equals are out there and that they all have awesome reputations.
My question: Nate knew a little bit about this new team from chasing them. He's chased a lot of people. We know he caught Sophie before in the past, did he ever catch Hardison, Parker or Eliot or did he just chase them?
christian is also a musician, i was just wondering if any future episodes will show eliot singing?
First of all, wet Eliot in a wifebeater with cuffs … from the bottom of my shallow, lascivious heart, I thank you, sir.
Second, fantastic show! Team v. anti-team, with all the resultant chaos (ahem), was delicious to watch. And the "gunslinger" scene between Hardison and Chaos was hysterical. (And, yeah, members of anti-team MUST come back!!)
Third, as others have said, thanks for giving us a woman who actually has padding on her bones and who looks like she might actually be a match for Eliot. While cuffed to Eliot … Sorry.
I loved the scar exchange. A bit of Lethal Weapon 3 perhaps? But you know it's what these two would do. (And was Christian's scar real? I can't imagine you have to fake any for him.)
And, yeah, I would so love it if she were the sniper who shot Eliot. A romance made somewhere south of heaven, where a date becomes Fear Factor. Ah, romance …
Also, Parker creeping out over dead-not-dead Sophie was just so Parker! Good to see she's not losing her, eh, Parkerness.
And huge, HUGE congrats on Season 3!!! Hip hooray and huzzah!
You'll have probably answered this by the time you get this far in the questions, but has there really been a renewal order given for Season Three? I haven't found anything online anywhere except for this comment thread. Would love to be proved wrong, though, by someone coming in and posting a link.
Made of Win, Rogers. Made of Win. As others have mentioned, the not-fight was awesome (and way to go on the casting there), pretty much every bit with Parker and Apollo was awesome, and I quite enjoyed the gunslinger showdown bit. The tombstone thing threw me some, but whatever.
Notification here:
http://news.turner.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=4617
From the Leverage Facebook group.
And here are the details
http://ausiellofiles.ew.com/2009/08/27/this-just-in-tnt-renews-leverage/
Here's an actual question, albeit not specifically related to 207. Quoth the season-3-pickup press release: "LEVERAGE scores tremendously well with DVR users, garnering an extraordinary 66% growth among adults 25-54 when comparing Live to Live + 7 viewing." Do you have any insight into this? Do you know how it compares to other new scripted cable dramas?
Congrats on a third season! It's well deserved. May i suggest an international premier for season three? I'd love to see the crew stealing the crown jewels or something.
Chaos was great, and had the best line of the ep with his baby quip! But I liked him, why'd you have to turn him evil? :-P
I hoped the team would overcome the other team thanks to the cross training they'd been doing, to show how they're stronger because they've helped each other, rather than just teaming up for money.
I loved how you emphasised that they're still criminals, and to hear their reputation among other criminals was great.
Hardison going old school! Love it.
Now i want to see Eliot in a proper sword fight, please. (is that your insurance agent i can hear crying?). Also good to see him speaking another language. I get the feeling Eliot's a lot more clever than he ever lets on or is given credit for.
And i cant believe everyone has overlooked Parkers amazing acrobatics with the lasers. That was wicked cool! Seriously.
Is there any chance if we harass the network that they will rethink their strategy and wont have a break mid season? I have zero patience.
For what was billed as a penultimate episode, you guys sure didn't let us down!
The entire show was perfect, from the casting to the pace to the ending. There were so many mood and emotion changes I can see why you were going with this to originally end the summer season.
I especially liked the pudding to stabilize the nitroglycerine motion bomb. Perfect usage of an item and it actually would work.
Folks here keep calling Dunne's team the "evil" version. Don't do that, folks...they are just on a different (read: financial gain) mission than our Leverage team. It would be good to see everyone except Dunne's character and Chaos (sorry, Wil, you turned on everyone in the episode over jealousy) work with the team in the future in some capacity. Could also set up for a blown mission as...OK, I am giving my own ideas up here!
My question is: Sophie seems to have been in a funk since the departure of the boyfriend as to who she is. Will this have an effect on her abilities as a grifter?
Does the Leverage team still do "outside" jobs?
I've caught some hints like they each (occasionally) do their own thing, but I could be wrong.
Btw, Wil Wheaton as Chaos was made of WIN.
Oh, man, I love the anti-team so much. I would welcome a return appearance by these guys. I laughed and laughed and laughed at Elliot and Ms. Mossad falling instantly and totally in Fight Love.
This was my favorite episode of the season, and possibly my favorite episode of the entire series. In part for the overall fun, in part for the wonderful character work by Ms. Bellman, and in part for the continuing, worrisome hints that Nate Ford is, at his core, Not a Very Nice Person At All. Kudos also to Mr. Devlin, whose direction gets ever more adept, lively, and stylish.
My "I am a huge comics nerd" question: I see other folks referencing the sequence in which Elliot and Ms. Mossad play out entire fights just by glancing at their respective stances as a tribute to the Midnighter. Me, I'm thinking Ogami Itto of Lone Wolf & Cub, yes? Or was it just a cool thing to do?
Was the irony in having Eliot's mirror be a former Mossad agent, when the Leverage team's caper revolved around recovering a piece of art stolen by the Nazis, intentional?
And may I say that my Trek flag flew free when I heard the Kobyashi Maru reference. }}:-)
Best episode to date! Loved it!
Why wouldn't our team just move a table under Sophie's bomb? You can stack up some magazines to get it the right height, and, viola, walk away without moving the bomb.
Congratulations on the renewal for a third season. Certainly made my day. Sure wish we could have the 15 episodes run now instead of being split. But oh well, first season dvd and current seaseon tape will have to suffice.
Last nights episode was truly awesome, looking forward to watching it again. Keep up the great work.
1st comment: Parkers outfit during the funeral: almost pornography. Seriously.
2nd: if there is anything between Parker and this Apollo guy, I shall be _so_ cross. The nerd has to get the girl for once!
I have to admit, last week's episode made me hesitant to get my hopes up about this but oh my god! It was hard to sit in my cube farm and watch this without busting a gut every other minute, for all the reasons listed already. Beautiful and almost perfect.
The music though... will we be getting some new score for the second half of the season?
word verify: parumt - What the Little Drummer Boy just did.
Jon, when, if you know, will Leverage be coming onto UK screens, I have held off torrenting because I really want to experience the show on television.
Great ep, and congrats on Season 3 to everybody.
Are there any plans for a blu-ray release of the show? Very much would like to buy the season 1 set, but want the glorious HD I know it exists in on the other side of the cable broadcast.
Thanks!
@wedgex
x-posted from LJ - were the Cinemascope flash forwards at the start of the Eliot/Noa fights an homage to Boorman's HELL IN THE PACIFIC?
Congrats on the 3rd season!
While it was overshadowed later with the fight scene, I thought Eliot and the bomb advice was competence porn at its finest.
Beth and Apollo were great together! I loved the bird discussion.
I'll take a split season if it means not having to wait 37 weeks between seasons (congrats on the renewal!)
My only question - is that Apollo's hat that Eliot's wearing at Sophie's funeral? It was awesome in a show full of awesome sauce.
Oh my goodness. the Competence Porn...I'm still turned on. Kudos to all and sundry.
I liked that Parker had the idea for Pudding right off, but it only went halfway. With pudding in the mix, you could have taken the entire vase and carefully placed in the freezer that was behind Sophie in almost the entire scene. Even if the bomb had gone off after being placed, it still would have been inside a freezer.
I like it that Sophie was the one that Kaos, and supposedly everyone else, was always scared of.
But then again it may be because they saw her one woman show. "An Evening with Lady Macbeth"
I will say that this episode sort of points up something that is easy to forget, and that is, that making Hack Fights visually interesting is kind of tough. The cut back and forth between Hardison and Kaos when they're trying to gain control of the systems accomplishes it, but it's kind of hard to use visual elements in that sort of thing without running up against the cold hard wall of what the audience actually knows. While pretty, the visual interface elements in the movie "Hackers" kicked out any person who had actually ever worked with a computer. Ugh.
Sophie's breaking my heart. Make her stop.
Also: Nate is in dire need of a swift kick in the head, spiritually. Any chance we'll see D.B. Sweeney again?
BEST EP YET!!!!!!!!
Congrats on getting season 3!
Gotta ask again.......
When can we see some OFFICIAL #leverage gear?
@alikitty619
Great ep!
Whose idea was the name "Stark" for Nate's evil twin? And it must be for Tim's evil twin in "The Dark Half," right?
Congrats on the renewal!!
I don't really have a question just wanted to pass along my congratulations on pick up for season 3.
I look forward to the craziness that you and your writing staff will cook up. Oh and may I just suggest more wet Eliot please?
Although, I was curious when Eliot brings Moussad lady out from the basement area his wonderful hair is completely dry so was there a hair dryer hidden somewhere?
Question about dvds (know you can't answer, but maybe you can direct me to who at Paramount/MGM to contact)
I love Leverage, and wanted to introduce the show to a hearing disabled friend. I was surprised and disappointed there's not captioning/English subtitles on the dvds. Is there a reason for this? Can we get them on the next season?
P.S. Congrats on Season Three and am really enjoying these latest eps of Season Two.
I second briddie on the love for the competence porn with Eiot and the bomb. I took it (and the way Nate immediately turned to him for advice) as a subtle (or as subtle as a bomb can be) reminder that Eliot's experience and talents are much darker than the rest of the team's. It was a nice callback to the Mile High Job, where Nate asked Eliot how he'd go about taking someone out, and Eliot was immediately able to tell him.
I also liked the fact that Eliot spoke Hebrew. We all know Sophie is a one-woman UN, but it would make sense that, given what we know of his background, Eliot would have to be able to pick up languages, too. Very nice reminder that there's definitely a brain under those muscles and that hair. And wifebeater. And handcuffs. Damn …
Also cool that Noa Tishby's character (what was her name?) knew about Eliot. Which raises the question, does the Mossad know about Eliot? And how? (Season 3, I'm just sayin'.)
And Parker cartwheeling through the lasers? Epic. Honestly, the whole damn thing was just made. of. win.
I'd like to join in the fangirl choir thanking you for putting Eliot in a wet tanktop. I would also like to add my adoration over casting Noa Tisby as his counterpart, she was hot and looked competent. Please bring her back sometime (preferably to kick Sterling's ass).
Really really loved this episode.
Now, my question: What is Hardison's hacker alias?
Woohoo S3! I just shouted it out in my office and half the place started cheering (don't get excited, that's like, four people).
Oh yeah, forgot to add... Apollo and Parker where adorable! Especially liked the scenen in the airduct. Please bring him back to - maybe in season 3? Congrats on that btw :)
I started watching Leverage because I loved Tim Hutton in Nero Wolfe. I've been thrilled with co-stars from that show - Saul Rubinek and Kari Matchett - showing up on Leverage.
Any chance you could get Carlo Rota in as a bad guy? I loved him in the Wolfe series also. He's good as a good guy - but he's GREAT as a bad guy. *lol*
And I have come to love ALL the characters of Leverage. So glad to hear we have a 3rd season to look forward to - to learn more about these people.
Who put the bomb in Sophie's hands? Wouldn't she have had to come face-to-face with the Wil?
I quite enjoyed this episode.
I second the Carlo Rota suggestion. He's fabulous!
Also, funniest line in the ep?
"Handcuffs? Y'all nasty."
Loved the episode! Fantastic in so many ways that have already been mentioned in the comments. But no one has mentioned the Post-It note! That cracked me the hell up. Oh, Hardison.
True or false: Hardison and Parker have weekly Star Trek viewing sessions, and they saw the new movie six times.
I lovelovelove the male thief Parker was having her friendly rivalry with. I hope he comes back every now and then, not as a romance, but just as a friend. Parker is getting a bit more used to emotions and normal interaction, but I'd love to see her hanging out with someone as crazy as she is. Their bird conversation was really cute.
The female Mossad agent was awesome as well. Props for getting a woman who actually looks like an ass-kicker. The mind-fights between her and Eliot were great, as has been said many times. I wish their actual showdown had been a bit bigger, though. I was hoping for some whisk-fu, appetizer-weapon style craziness between the two of them, and maybe some running around trying to find higher ground or get the jump on the other person. Isn't one of the main principals of Krav Maga (which I'd assume the Mossad agent would primarily use) to utilize whatever you can as a shield or weapon? I can't really believe that a professional female fighter would continue to fight an equally well-trained man bare-handed, since odds are he's stronger than her.
I loved the bit where she and Eliot were comparing scars, though. And Eliot speaking Hebrew!!! (How long is it going to take the rest of the team to realize Eliot's a lot smarter than they give him credit for?)
If the Mossad agent could show up again in an episode or two, just because she's badass, that would be amazing.
Can Eliot fight a ninja-type at some point? Someone who's a fighter, but who fights with trickery and stealth and such. I'd love to see him trying to get his hands on someone who just keeps slipping away (or trying to figure out what the hell is going on cause his opponent is wearing night-vision goggles and has turned out the lights in the room so Eliot can't see anything). It'd be a possibility for another female fighter, too.
Oh, and I really enjoyed the negative interactions between the team in this episode. Eliot needling Nate in the living room, Sophie getting irritated with Parker, Sophie undervaluing what Hardison does in the van . . . I love those kinds of moments in every episode. The annoying, frustrating aspects of friendship.
The song playing while Sophie and Nathan were in the graveyard was gorgeous. I've heard it on the show before; is it going to become a kind of "romance theme?"
Parker diving through the moving lasers to get to the painting was a Crowning Moment of Awesome.
The female Mossad agent was awesome as well. Props for getting a woman who actually looks like an ass-kicker.
Way more experienced than she looks, too. Doesn't look her age.
Do you have any idea how exhausting it is to watch an episode made of whee, squee! and hee? I need a nap.
Would not normally just write to congratulate on an episode, but with the news of a third season being approved and this being the best episode of the season so far.
I have to ask will Wil Wheaton be back his Chaos character needs retribution. Also having read his blog this week, he has been having a very bad week and could do with a pick up.
Congrats on the third season, John! After that episode, I'd say it was well earned; probably my favorite of the whole series.
This episode was chock full of things to love, between the general idea of the crew facing off against their "evil twins", to the mental showdown between Elliot and his Mossad counterpart (and the Jaws homage they go through at the end), to the pickpocketing war between Parker and her counterpart, and...there's just too many to list.
My favorite moment, though, was just after Sophie told Nate to get out and let her drop the bomb alone. You see him run off, and while the camera's close on Sophie, you can see Nate juuuuuuuust out of focus, peeking his head out to make sure she's okay.
My question: Was that scripted? Or did Dean/Tim/Chris/you/whatever combo of two or more improvise that on the set?
And while we're at it: The gravestone for Sophie Deveraux. I thought she was "buried" under the Katherine alias? When did they bury the Sophie alias? Or am I just leaving a penny on the fun train tracks?
WIN WIN AND MORE WIN!
Loved this episode.
Although the Nate/Sophie shipper in me was left desperately frustrated by the end of the episode.
Please tell me we'll see some sort of resolution there? *pouts*
Now that's a good episode. I laughed 3 times out loud.
Pokey Parker didn't work as well this time around.
You evil, evil man! So close to a smootch.
This show needs a song. I've started one, but need some help to finish it.
The Leverage Song
There's a girl named Sophie that I'm dream-ing of,
Just need to figure out if what I feel, is love,
Should I try to fight it, oh, oh, uh, oh,
Does she feel the same, oh, oh, uh, oh,
Got a funny feelin' that's not her name,
There's a girl named Parker that I've seen, around,
Jumping out of windows just to knock me to, the ground,
Shouldn't try to fight her, no, no, na, no,
Can you feel the pain, oh, oh, uh, oh,
You just gotta trust her, running her own game,
Please suggest changes. It could definitely use some choruses for Elliot and Hardison, and maybe a bridge for Nate!
Yay for some Eliot almost-shirtlessness! And there was water involved. Be still my heart.
Wil Wheaton IS the sexy (aside from Aldis, Christian, and Timothy, though not necessarily in that order!).
I loved the match-up between the two crews. Too much fun. I did notice the other team kind of lacked a Sophie - was Marcus Nate and Sophie rolled into one?
Can we get an episode where Hardison is locked up and the team finally respects the van? The Mile High Job seemed to have shades of this, but I'd love to see one where he is totally out of commission and they realize just how much harder their jobs would be without him being all "whiffy" in the van.
First, congrats on the 3rd Season.
Second, congrats on yet another great episode.
However, coming after the Top Hat job, we have a second con where it looks like it's all gone pear shaped and then it turns out it was all according to plan after all.
I realise this is a time honoured way of telling con job stories, but I'm beginning to miss the stories where a team plans a con, executes the plan and encounters genuine problems they hadn't planned for and still overcomes them. Are we getting more like that at all in what's left of the Summer episodes or in the Winter season?
Because too much of the stories like this one and Top Hat and it feels like it's all a con on the audience to me. And while it did fit the theme of Top Hat and the style of Two Live Crew, too much more and I'm not sure I'll still enjoy being conned.
If I end up not getting invested in the story and the con because whatever happens, it was all part of Nate or "Sophie"'s plan then I'll probably lose interest. Don't worry - I trust you guys and I don't see myself stopping watching the show at all right now.
But please tell me we'll see something different soon?
Congratulations on season 3!
All I can say is "Wow." Totally blew my socks off with this one, it was 42 minutes of squee and awesome.
Pretty much everyone's said what I wanted to say, so I can only repeat that Wil Weaton rocks, Apollo is a tiny god (sorry) and needs to star more often and the whole Mirror, Mirror thing was just fantastically well done.
And massive congratulations on Season 3! That news totally made my day.
I wish I could think of some smart questions for you but the Fun Train bowled me over and left me speechless. Kudus all round, guys, that was just a fabulous piece of television.
Going to put in my two cents regarding the ep. First, it doesn't surprise me at all that it was Sophie that Chaos was so scared of. Sophie is the almost certainly the one with the longest criminal career. She's older than everyone else on the crew except for Nate and Nate's criminal career started barely a year ago. Plus, I tend to imagine Sophie's career starting at around age three helping her mom run scams.
Note to whoever said that Sophie was the only one without an evil twin: I disagree. I see Stark as being a dupe for Sophie or maybe as an unholy amalgam of the her and Nate. He was a grifter who worked with her for years, and as an art thief to boot. He's Sophie if she decided to run a criminal crew.
Finally, a real question. I find it stunning that Stark didn't check the painting to make sure it was the one that he was after. Honor among thieves just doesn't cut it. Normally, I'd just accept that the forgery would fool him at least for awhile, but he painted the forgeries himself! I'll admit that I don't know enough about art and forgery to call BS on that. It could be that his forgeries were good enough to fool even himself for at least a while. Was he just counting on goodwill from his ex-partner (Sophie)? Was he counting on his rep to protect him from that because it's assumed he'll wreak some horrible vengeance if someone pulls something like that on him? Did we just not get to see him checking the painting in the interest of saving screen time?
See? Me crossing my fingers for a 3rd season in my post last night totally helped ;) Absolutly deserved. Go and celebrate.
Google confirms that this is the first time anyone has ever used the exact words "Wil Wheaton's electric sexuality" on the internet.
grats on the ding
now if i can just get caught up..
@JP Corkery: For Top Hat Job, I didn't get the impression at all that the problems they encountered were part of their plan. Between the difficulty getting into various places, necessitating the improv with CEO-in-a-box, and Evil Erik with a K deleting all the copies of the report before they could snag one, I very much got the feeling they were making stuff up on the fly.
It's just proof of how good they really are. Even in a tight spot, with a plan going south, they can still pull out the win.
There was a lot to love about this episode, and I'm sure the other fans will cover those things in the comments pretty exhaustively. There was a lot I loved here. But was it completely necessary to open the episode with Nate and Sophie conning an innocent secretary through the threat of sexual violence? "Your boss is a mass-murderer-slash-rapist, you're his type, and he's coming back tomorrow"? Really? REALLY? Way to advance the culture of rape in America. Way to pander to the assholes who think jokes about rape are funny, or that making women into victims is funny. I hope lots of twelve year old boys learned their lesson, that threatening women with sexual violence will help them get their way! The really amazing part is that the little threat-of-rape-and-murder plot was completely unrelated to the main plot, and they could've distracted the secretary with ANYTHING - which I guess means yall think it's just a hilarious and funny joke when women are made to live in fear. I expected better from this show, which is why it hurts more to see this here than it does to see it everywhere else (which we do, every day). Do better. I love this show. Do better.
(if I get an answer that's like, "oh, Nate and Sophie told the secretary offscreen that they had the wrong man," I'll be even more disappointed. I don't want a retcon or a Watsonian explanation; this kind of fuckup isn't like fucking up Hardison's perl script. Just please think about how you can make your show a little less rapey, would you, please?)
I'm SO HAPPY for the entire Leverage team -- and US FANS -- that S3 is locked in!!!
Last night's episode was absolutely wonderful! As everyone before me has already said, it really had it all. Loved the way things were left between Nate and Sophie. And LOOOOOOOVED Eliot's wet hair, "costume," props and "action" in his last few scenes! (Start thinking S3 now.... :)
*inches past the psycho-rant-person two posts up* Yeah... take your meds.
Fun episode. Good byplay between the counterparts on each team.
For those who keep asking about the tombstones... at the funeral, the tombstone read 'Katherine Clive' (given that there is also a poster from her 'Sound of Music' appearance, I'm guessing that the folks attending knew her through that). It's not until the end scene that there is a new tombstone that reads 'Sophie Devereaux'. Given Gina's dialogue in that scene, it makes a great deal of sense that she'd have the stone replaced for the symbology.
And yes, I'll add my own voice to the remarks about why couldn't they just take care of the bomb in a less hectic manner. Although it seems that the things that tend to stick in my brain (the bomb and the 'head south from Nebraska to reach... Iowa?? bit from 2.02) are things that grate because of one fairly minor inconsistency. With the Iowa thing, a quick ADR swaping 'Iowa' with 'Kansas' could fix it entirely. And with the bomb this episode, if Sophie had never lifted the bomb up before dropping it, no issue.
*shrug* Still ends up as great television, either way. Looking forward to the rest of season 2, and very much glad there will be a season 3.
If we're going to get all nitpicky about the bomb, it's interesting how TV explosions always go out, never up and down. (Sorry neighbor!)
So when y'all were casting for alter-Eliot, did you specifically set out to find someone with matching hair? Or was that just the universe aligning in your favor?
You know if Christian ever visits this blog, he'll leave with an ego the size of Texas.
Okay, I've been thinking about the whole Sophie name and tombstone things all day. I know that Katherine Clive's tombstone was at the beginning and Sophie's was at the end. I don't think she switched them out. I think Sophie is using people who have died and she either knew them or knew about them as her aliases. That's why she made comments about borrowing a stranger's grave and knowing their parents and first kiss. I think she actually went to go visit Sophie's grave at the end (not switch out since it's not same graveyard). It makes the whole burying that alias idea work. At first, I thought she was saying that she had made up their life stories, but then after thinking about it, I think she knew them.
Oh, and concerning Eliot's thing with the girl...yes, it was hot and sexy, but I hope it's not a permanent thing. It was a little more predictable than I was comfortable for in a storyline that doesn't cater to predictability. Now that everybody's all excited about his "handcuffs" and all...let's move on. I'm happy for him and all that, but I think there's so much more to him than that...
Loved the geek-guru show down...Go Hardison! You and Parker are my heroes!
The Blockage Crew or some of its members at least, have to return. Seeing Griffin Dunne and Wil on the same show was a treat.
Noa Tishby is awesome and cool and needs a recurring role.
That is all!
That episode was just a hell of a lot of fun to watch.
Thanks.
Wow. That is about all I can say to sum up my feelings for this episode. The other crew was awesome, and I loved all the interactions! Especially the flashforwards. Are you going to make those pop up some time in the future, or was it a onetime deal? I also love how Chaos also had orange soda, and their little geek showdown, along with Eliot's scenes with the other hitter, especially when they were comparing scars, and the handcuff comment.
Congratulations on a 3rd season! I was so excited I was jumping up and down. We get more leverage awesomeness!
Quick question. I know you said on your twitter that the tombstone heading was changed on purpose. Can you tell us why, or is that a secret?
"But was it completely necessary to open the episode with Nate and Sophie conning an innocent secretary through the threat of sexual violence? "Your boss is a mass-murderer-slash-rapist, you're his type, and he's coming back tomorrow"? Really? REALLY? Way to advance the culture of rape in America."
I totally get where you're coming from. I'm a total feminist, and I'm all over politics of sexual power. I viewed that scene the exact opposite way you did, though. I view the entire Leverage show as a bit of a satire. I mean, most of the episodes are exposing white-collar crime that is generally downplayed in the news when tends to be even more destructive than "real" crimes like car theft. So I actually saw that dialogue as making fun of the intense fear of rape instilled in American women from a young age (despite the fact that the crime rate is pretty much going down, violent crime more so).
It all relates back to the extreme discomfort with and fear of sex that Americans tend to have. Check out news reports on "sexting" if you don't know what I'm talking about.
Also, I think it would be incredibly funny if, for a future job, Hardison's status as a Large Black Man was used to advance the con in some way. He could intimidate someone (because, despite how physically harmless Hardison is, most white people are afraid of black men deep down), or integrate himself into a group of blacks where white people wouldn't be easily accepted (gang, hip-hop culture, gangsta culture, ect.), or something. It'd be interesting to explore Hardison's "blackness" a bit (I know in my high school, computer classes are dominated by whites and asians). You could get some really funny situations with Hardison very out of his element. I trust you guys could pull it off without anything coming off coarse or racist.
Great ep! and congrats for Season 3! =)
i got 2 questions:
1) this was supposed to be for ep 202, but i noticed that the Philippine flag was shown 2 times..was that a shout out? just wonderin..
2) for this ep, can u please bring back Apollo & Noa? i really loved em. or maybe for the next eps, they could team up with the leverage crew?? =)
Okay, I know I'm kind of shallow now, but I do think a girl's entitled. Christian, wet, tank top... Yum! As for the boys, I'm sure they all liked Noas cleveage. ;-)
You've had Parker, You've had Stark, will you reference Dortmunder? Please say yes.
Was female Elliot of Mirror Universe Leverage team Mossad trained?
And the episode answered my Mossad question for me, sorry.
No Mirror Universe Sophie because Sophie is the link between the two teams?
I'll be short. Episode Rocked!
So much to love .... too much to mention (but I did LOVE all the "Fantasy Fight" sequences - I think it worked really well to do it that way).
My question is: What does the License plate "186 KVE" on Nate's car signify? (if anything)
And in closing .. thanks for the .. well, I'll be blunt: Thanks for the Wet Christian Kane.
Marvelous episode. Best one yet, IMO. Loved the anti-team, especially Apollo and Noa Tishby. I'm crossing my fingers for a recurring role for her-she was absolutely stunning. Congratulations on a third season. And thank you for the wet Eliot.
Upon rewatching last night's episode I did come up with one question.
What was Noa saying during the Blockage team's briefing? I'm talking about that bit without the subtitles. I heard Elliot's name, but unfortunately my Hebrew is rusty (and by that I mean non-existent).
Also was it you or Amy who wrote the Jello/wiggle room line? Hilarious even the second time around.
In reply to those wondering about Sophie lifting the vase before dropping it, it seems only natural to want to lift the vase higher to give her more time to escape. Now you and I all know that in real world physics that extra foot and a half off of the ground is equivalent to milliseconds of actual time, but in TV physics that is practically hours. She probably could have grabbed a snack on the way out. And to those commenting on how she could have set it down once the pudding set, have you ever tried making instant pudding without a refrigerator? It isn't that solid I assure you.
Congrats again on a third season, I look forward to the inevitable fabulousness.
So I actually saw that dialogue as making fun of the intense fear of rape instilled in American women from a young age.
Where's the good in that? Threatening a woman with the possibility of sexual assualt is not funny. It's manipulative and downright nasty.
Where's the good in that? Threatening a woman with the possibility of sexual assualt is not funny. It's manipulative and downright nasty.
Where's the good in making making fun of the USA's habit of messing around in the politics of other countries? Where's the good in making fun of white-collar criminals getting laughably light sentences? Joking about something serious doesn't diminish the reality or magnitude of the problem, it just presents it to people in an easily digestible form.
The show makes jokes about violence all the time. "Did you just kill a guy with an appetizer?", the flashbacks about monkeys, ect. These are not presented in a satirical fashion, and have been easily accepted by the audience as far as I can tell.
This particular joke was about sexual violence. However, the humor of the joke came from the fact that the show was either making fun of the fact that serial killers are around every corner in television and movies or that women in the US are told to live in constant fear of rapists. Either way, the way I saw it, the joke depended on the viewer recognizing the way sexual violence, and particularly serial killings, are portrayed in the media and finding the absurdity in it.
So I actually saw that dialogue as making fun of the intense fear of rape instilled in American women from a young age.
Where's the good in that? Threatening a woman with the possibility of sexual assualt is not funny. It's manipulative and downright nasty.
Agreed--but I didn't read the scene that way, especially because they didn't say "your boss will be back tomorrow"; but "he's probably in Canada by now, and he won't be back".
It came across to me like they were trying to make her think he was a monster--so that when he does come back the next day, she'll call the real police--or at the very least, treat him with disgust. And *that* suits the team's idea of poetic justice for a guy who'd knowingly buy art stolen during the Holocaust and bribe a judge to dismiss the case brought by the legitimate owners.
And *that* suits the team's idea of poetic justice for a guy who'd knowingly buy art stolen during the Holocaust and bribe a judge to dismiss the case brought by the legitimate owners.
They weren't talking about him. They were talking about the guy that ran the office next door to him. Completely innocent.
Where's the good in that? Threatening a woman with the possibility of sexual assualt is not funny. It's manipulative and downright nasty.
Oh, and the team kind of makes their living on things that are manipulative and downright nasty. Off the top of my head
- Hardison had a flight attendant miss her flight in The Mile High Job. Parker then told at least on of her colleagues the woman was sleeping her way to the top. Both can be very damaging to the woman's career.
- Eliot hurts and kills people. A lot.
-Sophie has stolen several million dollars from the US government.
- Nate, before his son was killed, was probably a lot more like Sterling than he wants to admit and worked to keep people from getting money they needed from the insurance company to save the company money.
- Nate and the rest of the team convinced a man he was dying of a horrible contagious disease. That is some deep psychological trauma.
- Nate is rather sadistic.
- Hardison's criminal career is based on stealing money through the Internet and computer systems. Do you really think he only steals from 'bad' people? That man could have a crazy pyramid scheme going that your neighbors and grandma are both involved in.
- The team locked the CEO of the food company in The Top Hat Job in a small space for a long time. Don't tell me that man didn't get hurt when Eliot was slamming that box around the elevator.
Yes, the Leverage team are all likable characters, and they're the protagonists of the series. But they are not Good People. I see no reason why they would balk at threatening a woman with implications of sexual assault and murder. Well, Hardison (who balks at any kind of physical violence) and Eliot (who tends to have a very Southern, rather patriarchal attitude towards women) might not. None of the others would blink twice. Parker might smile as she says it.
great episode. Congrats to all for being picked up for a S3. Cant wait to see where ya'll will take us. I have to agree with all the other ladies, please more wet, tank top or wet shirtless Christian. The whole cast does an aweosme job and the writers are superb. I liked seeing Apollo, that was a nice add. He and Parker have some good chemistry there, would like to see where that leads.
"Two Live Crew" was GLEEFUL. I loved seeing Apollo as, well... Apollo. He and Beth were great. And Eliot and Mikel Dayan were HILARIOUS. I loved the "vintage" clips of them fighting, extrapolated solely from change in stance. It was a beautiful, hilarious gag. And the comparing scars at the end? Even better. I also adored the Nate and Sophie tag, tho I too was confused by the heastone. Then again, with vacation homes in India, Ireland, and Japan, I'm sure Sophie could afford a headstone if she chose to bury her past metaphorically and physically...
Bardic Lady: Marlowe and Archer are hardboiled detectives. Phillip Marlowe was played by Bogie in The Big Sleep. Miles Archer is Sam Spade's dead partner in Dashiell Hammett's The Maltese Falcon (and Spade was also played by Bogie). Both characters (along with another great noir detective, The Continental Op) appeared in Black Mask, a pulp mag, back in the day.
CindyD: I think probably the Maltese Falcon is more likely than Lew Archer? Only The Writers Know For Sure (and I'm sure Rogers will settle it, if we end up at pistols-at-dawn).
To All Assembled: If you haven't read Chandler, I highly recommend The Simple Art of Murder, which collects an essay and some Marlowe short stories/novellas, as a great place to start.
(I personally prefer Chandler over Hammett and Cain cos with the latter two, all the men are fools and all the women are evil and after a while you lose your faith in the idea of common human decency. Whereas Chandler's Phil Marlowe has a core of decency you never doubt--even when he's acting against it. Also, he gets beat up a lot. I measure my hardboiled detectives by how often and how well they can take a punch. And I include Honey West in there.)
Darkrose: Except they were sneaking into the office next door, so they could cut through the wall. For what it's worth? I never got "rapist" from the dialogue. I got "murder-you-and-feed-your-body-through-the-woodchipper". Not that that's necessarily better? But it is suitably over-the-top for it to be comedy, for me... Not that I am advocating the rape culture. Just calling it like I see it.
Yeah, that was my bad--I got confused as to who was where.
I still didn't read it as threatening rape, though--but it was a pretty nasty thing to do to the poor guy who's going to come back from his trip and discover that the receptionist thinks he's a serial killer.
Then again, as someone pointed out above, our team doesn't always worry about the collateral damage of their scams. They have a very ends justify the means attitude toward their jobs.
OK am I the only person here who watches classic Doctor Who? As soon as the Mona Lisa variant and five paintings showed up, I was rolling on the floor. Maybe this is because I recently watched City of Death ... the sticky note at the end was priceless.
Congratulations on getting renewed!
There have been Chandler aliases, there needs to be a Stout one, preferably with Timothy Hutton using one of them.
Don't forget the Emmy question.
Oooh, I didn't even think of this until I read catchester's comment that Christian would get an ego boost if he were to read these posts. DOES everybody in the show read these posts? Actually, do they normally read what's being said about them and the show on other sites, as well?
We're so fortunate to get direct feedback from you. However, since we don't get the opportunity to hear from the cast members, it would be interesting to know if they actually read what their fans have to say. Or is the prospect so time-consuming that they have someone on staff breeze through "fan mail" in order to determine whether each comment should be placed and tallied in the positive, negative or in-between category, for instance?
Thanks for any insights you can share along these lines.
I still didn't read it as threatening rape, though--but it was a pretty nasty thing to do to the poor guy who's going to come back from his trip and discover that the receptionist thinks he's a serial killer.
I was assuming that based on the line about the nail polish, for some reason. Probably comes from watching too much "Criminal Minds." On that show, whenever a serial killer is taking an interest in how the victims look, 9 times out of 10, they're about to get raped.
What happened to Nate's Tesla? :)
Congratulations on the 3rd season! This gives me one less thing to fret about and one more thing to look forward to. I hope you realize that many of us would like, oh.....51 episodes, maybe? I know you have been saying you need rest so here is hoping you get some, recharge and come up with more brilliance for next season!
On the "The Three Days of the Hunter Job" you mentioned "Eliot, ironically, is the second best grifter after Sophie." Is this the evolution of the character? In past posts, and on the DVD commentaries, I thought you had hinted that this character isn't as good at the cons. Just curious.
Just to comment on some of the other comments - I don't think the team thinks of Eliot as all brawn and no brains. Well, okay, Nate thought he could only break heads in "The Wedding Job". I guess it is all in how one interprets a character. I always saw the character as a little deeper than that. Maybe not proficient at computers, at first, but maybe a man of deep thoughts but not a lot of words.
As for the DVD - it does indicate that it is close captioned but it doesn't seem to work independently. If your TV has close captioning, then it works. It really is a benefit since you can then get all the brillian and witty writing.
This week's episode was a favorite. The showdowns between each pairing of characters, both physically and mentally, was great. Great casting, great writing and great directing. I can see why you selected it to be the end of the summer season. I also appreciate that you aren't as big into cliffhangers. It is just enough to have to wait for the next season.
So funny when Eliot tried to cover up the handcuffs as Hardison walked by...to no avail. Hardison's smirk over the shoulder was hilarious.
The "flash forwards" were a great tool. The extremes and the film style made me think of Christian's Secondhand Lions scenes.
Lots of fun, great episode and YAYYAYYAY on S3. I propose 12 episodes in the summer, 12 in the winder. That will work for me. Shoot in Portland again if you can't come to Sacramento. At least you'll be on the right coast for Kane shows.
Are we going to get the eyecatches (the brief promos during commercial breaks or bracketing episodes where the cast members stare into the camera as it spins around and some guy talks in a deep voice) on the next DVD set?
Was Parker's idea about the secret Nazis a nod to her sudden interest in conspiracy theories after the Three Days of Hunter job? Cause no conspiracy wall is complete without some mention of the secret Nazi lizard men living at the center of the world.
Best episode this season yet, hands down, bar none. So glad you guys have a third season coming. Hoping you make it to lucky number seven.
1) Can we see more of Noa Tisby? (And by "see more" I mean that I think she and Eliot having an off-again, on-again relationship would be spectacular... Although, seeing her wet and shirtless WAS definitely eye candy...)
2) Does Hardison have a hacker name, or is that too "script kiddie" for him?
3) When, vaguely, will Season 3 start airing? I know you can't give me hard'n'fast dates (but if you can, that's impressive) but early next year? Mid next year? Beginning of next year? Or can we just have Leverage on once a week from now until everyone in the cast'n'crew is completely spent, say, 5-7 years from now?
Thaaaanks!
~c.
You can thank Wil for my wife and I watching the show. We had not heard of it until I saw Wil mention it on his blog. TNT happened to be running the pilot so we watched it, and were hooked. We loved "The Two Live Crew Job"
We would love to see our crew and the Anti-crew work together ( reluctantly of course) on a job!
We loved the Star Trek reference in the one scene where Aldis mentions Kobiashi Maru, and the only one who recognizes it's from Star Trek is Beth.
Great show all around. Keep up the great work!
Loved the episode. I actually thought the Top Hat Job was more of a 'squeeze' episode (where the team has to overcome obstacles that derail their initial plan) rather than a 'breeze' episode (where the reveals at the end show the team had it all going to plan the entire time). I prefer breeze episodes but I understand there needs to be both kinds.
I guess that leads to a question. Do you start out knowing what type an episode is, or is it something that comes out as you write?
Cei said: "*inches past the psycho-rant-person two posts up* Yeah... take your meds."
That was uncalled for -- you must be lucky enough not to have been raped or had someone in your life who was raped OR unfairly accused of rape. Many folks who have been unfortunate enough are NOT on meds and certainly are not nuts.
That said, great ep that clearly rises to the best level of season 1.
What I've noticed this season is that up until this ep, I haven't enjoyed the eps as much -- until I've seen them uninterupted by commercials online.
This one, I've seen both ways and enjoyed it just as much.
@Tara
Yes, I was already aware of all that (especially since Lew's name is known to be a homage to Hammett's Archer) but I hardly think pistols at dawn will be necessary! As I stated, these were merely my personal hopes, not an answer that I be presumptive enough to think I know. Just spreading the Lew love while saving any Hammett love for the Leverage finale "The Maltese Falcon Job". Is that me quivering with anticipation? Why, yes, it is!
Two things:
The Flash forwards on the fights.
Okay, Who do you think out of the trio of Rogers, Berg and Devlin is the old school Shaw Bros fan? My money is on Rogers.
Two. The Chaos spinoff.
Will the robots be old school Robby like tin cans or will they be sexy fembots who Chaos must teach how to love?
The Skeezy old perv in me would prefer the latter but given Mr. Wheaton's very happy marriage, I will forgive you if you go with the former.
Congrats on the new season pick-up! Now, how soon can you come up with 15 new cons...
Couldn't happen to a more generous bunch.
Oh man, I am two episodes behind but I made a point of watching the Wheaton episode.
You and Amy had Too Much Fun on that one. The Elliot vs woman scenes were absolute classics!!
And of course you had to call Wheaton "Chaos." I read his blog post several months ago too. You missed an opportunity there, however. Hardison: "Yeah, he's called 'Chaos' but dig it, the man is weird. He calls himself 'Chows'."
Wonderful episode!!
Two notes on Sophie:
1. I figured she'd just found a real "Sophie Deveraux" in the cemetary at the end -- maybe the one she'd based her persona on. But the tombstone thing did throw me at first.
2. Considering that the whole episode pivoted on Sophie's identity crisis, I thought (and really liked the notion) that Sophie was her OWN evil twin -- that the reformed, improved person she'd become was battling the "Sophie Devereaux" she used to be.
I'll also second Tara's recommendation of "The Simple Art of Murder," which includes my all-time favorite Chandler story, "Pearls Are a Nuisance," in which the author turns all his staple elements upside-down, makes hilarious fun of his own style, and still turns out a terrific tale.
Please tell the TNT humans responsible for the Leverage Facebook page that abusing their "put content on my wall" power for cross-promotion is not making them any friends.
FWIW, USA had this problem a couple months ago. They got some angry email after pimping their pro wrestling franchise via the Burn Notice page. Apparently nobody at the networks has been paying attention, and they think that this whole "social networking" thing is just an opt-in advertising channel. Welcome to 2009, guys...
Congrats on getting a third season.
This season has been great but this one and 'The Tap Out Job' are my favorites so far.
I don't try to think about it too much and just go with it. But I'm still not sure how or when the comms work.
Do the others hear both sides when Nate and later Sophie talk to Stark? And related to that if they do how does that work when Stark isn't wearing one (at least not from Nate's team)?
And do they hear everything that's said by any member of the team?
Eliot's "what's with all the uh-oh's" would suggest they do.
But when Sophie and Hardison talk in the van or her and Nate chat about Emily is that private or are the rest listening?
Sometimes there are two or more conversations going on at the same time and Eliot is fighting. I'd think all that chatter would be annoying and worse distracting.
This episode was perfection. I loved everything single moment. The Eliot fight kicked ass and i thought they were done for until Sophie came out... it was great.
I wanted to ask.. will we be finding out about Sophie's persona's?
Also, this question is about The Order 23 Job. I noticed how much focus Eliot lost on the job when he saw the little kid and i was wondering, did that happened to him as he was growing up? Is that why he ended up getting recruited or going into the forces or ops?
I'd really love to know more of his back story. Him and Parker are the ones that really seem alike in that their pants are a complete mystery.
Thanks for reading this and i hope you answer :D
I'm not gonna engage with folks over whether rape jokes are hilarious and funny, or get into why "jokes where the US and its foreign policy are the target" aren't quite the same as "jokes where women who fear rape are the target." But I do want to respond to darkrose, who said:
Agreed--but I didn't read the scene that way, especially because they didn't say "your boss will be back tomorrow"; but "he's probably in Canada by now, and he won't be back".
They say that he won't be back, but he will - as someone pointed out upthread, the guy they're talking about isn't the guy who bought the Nazi-stolen art. He'll come in the next day, and the secretary will think he wants to rape and kill her. And even if the boss were the guy who bought the Nazi-stolen art, making the secretary afraid of potential sexual violence in order to get back at someone is using her in a kind of horrifying way.
The combination of "you, young blonde secretary, are this serial killer's type" and "has he ever expressed interest in your toenail polish" make it a joke about sexual predators; the discourse on serial killers is a discourse about men hunting women, and it is inevitably sexualized. The threat that Nate and Sophie deliver is a threat of rape and murder, and to pretend otherwise is facile. Now, if you want to defend that action based on the fact that these characters have, in the past, broken the law in order to save orphans or beaten up, like, mafia hitmen, then I guess that's your prerogative.
@Robinyj and others who inquired about why Sophie didn't just set the vase down...
1) Because if someone sends you a bomb, of COURSE you want them to think it worked and you're dead, in order to smoke them out in relative safety. They probably knew/assumed the bomb-sender was watching the apartment too - hence, the bomb having to blow up ASAP. Which leads me to...
2) For the sake of argument, they probably wanted it to blow up as quickly as possible to avoid suspicion of a fake death.
3) And if we go with the "team predicts everything in advance" concept - they also wanted it to blow up because they were planning to use Sophie's death in the con as of the moment they knew a bomb had been sent to her.
Cheers!
Question: HOw many episodes will Gina Bellman miss due to her pregnancy and when is she actually due?
I dunno. I grew up with the feminist movement and work in a community of women that is focused on women's issues (and am a women myself) and I sure didn't infer the threats of sexual violence and potential murder in the nail polish and wood chipper scene. I did conclude the detectives were trying to freak the girl out by suggesting her boss had some peculiar proclivities, but sexual violence is a stretch.
Is Eliot turning into Agent Orange?
Unless Hardison is sneaking carrot-pills into Eliot's food, please have someone check makeup.
There's been 3 Orange Eliot and 2 Orange Sophie episodes. It's always in the 'happy yellow' lighted scenes (meaning I get distracted from competence porn and banter, my fave parts). Only Eliot and/or Sophie. Fix it, Mr. Rogers. I need my porn!
Just a general comment, that it's strange how people view things so differently.
The cop/receptionist scene didn't ring any alarm bells with me, a life long feminist.
What I have noticed is the fact that the only two kisses we've seen Eliot have, he's physically restrained the woman. I don't think consent was an issue with either kiss though, which is why i haven't come here raging and screaming "NO MEANS NO! I expect better of you, you evol agents of the patriarchy!"
And at the end of the day, Leverage is a TV show, not an advert for Women's Lib.
While Eliot's two kisses have been with "restrained" women, if you remember Aimee pinned him to the wall first in the Two HOrse Job and Miss Massaud was trying to hurt him so he either could have hit her or kissed her. I like his way.
The threat that Nate and Sophie deliver is a threat of rape and murder, and to pretend otherwise is facile.
I'm sorry that my comment about reading the scene differently came across as trying to pretend it was something else.
Now, if you want to defend that action based on the fact that these characters have, in the past, broken the law in order to save orphans or beaten up, like, mafia hitmen, then I guess that's your prerogative.
I wasn't saying that at all. I was pointing out that these characters have, in the course of saving orphans and scamming hitmen, taken actions that may have caused harm to innocent bystanders, and that they clearly consider that acceptable collateral damage. They are the good guys, but that doesn't mean they're always right.
OK am I the only person here who watches classic Doctor Who?
No. I was all over that too.
And as long as people are making wishlists for British actors to appear on the show, how about some of Gina's cohorts from Coupling making an appearance?
Regarding Parker's Laser Escapade: I'm guessing the Lasers were a visual effect, and not a practical one... in the commentary for the First David Job one of you mentioned it's tricky to make them visible.
Well, if they were a visual effect, then bravo to your effects team. They had the lasers reflecting in Parker's eyes. Going the extra mile.
Sorry, several questions jammed together.
Can you please bring back the Israeli lady? Many, many times?
Why no sub-titles on the season one DVD? Please make sure the season two DVD has them.
Did you ever think of maybe having the two "clients" walk out of the bar, pull off their disguises and walk off into the sunset with the painting?
And was this show shot out of sequence or did Sophie have the baby?
Thanks. Wonderful show.
>>>And as long as people are making wishlists for British actors to appear on the show, how about some of Gina's cohorts from Coupling making an appearance?
Heh-heh. I am evil. I request the guy who looked like Dennis Potter from Karaoke to appear. Alas, Gina would not think that funny. But I did warn I was being evil!
What I have noticed is the fact that the only two kisses we've seen Eliot have, he's physically restrained the woman.
Well, Aimee then shoved him against a wall and kissed him again. And Mossad woman could have stomped his foot or something if she was angry about it.
Eliot has also flirted with other many other women on-screen without any context of violence, and the show implies that he has the most active sex life out of any of the Leverage team.
I think the whole 'restrain the woman' thing just comes from the fact that Eliot's fighting ability and strength are two big parts to his over-all attractiveness. So if Eliot's in a romantic scene, in which his attractiveness is being played up, the show needs some way to show off his muscles, and its not like there're more than two people around.
I want to second what was mentioned a few posts up: Where did Nate's Tesla go? I loved the Tesla.
This could be my favorite episode yet. You put a post-it note on my favorite Van Gogh, though. I may have cringed in horror, and I'm not even an art person. I have a feeling that the post-it adhesive would do something horrible to the paint and cause Van Gogh scholars worldwide to faint dead away.
Other than that, this episode was made of win. Bravo. And congrats on the renewal! There was much rejoicing in my office.
If were asking for British actors, I understand David Tennant's availability is a bit better these days. ;)
"If were asking for British actors, I understand David Tennant's availability is a bit better these days. ;)"
Hmmm, Do I smell a "Doctor Who/Leverage" crossover? Throw in a Dalek or two and geek heads would explode from state to state!
complete left field comment- just rewatching your Comedy Now Stand up on the comedynetwork.ca website...I saw this when it originally aired and I always loved it. Use to catch it in reruns whenever I could. Now thanks to the net I can finally tell you :) ain't technology grand. I know you're now a kick ass writer- but I loved your stand up :)
What was the Mussad chick saying during the reverse briefing on Nate? cause it was kinda awesome that Apollo knew who he was and i would love it if even she was a bit leery of him
@24jg13 & Anon - Yes, you've just listed the reason why consent wasnt an issue.
I was just saying it's odd how people pick up on different things, and that is what tweeked my antena.
I've now seen it twice. "Top Hat Job" was a disappointment for me, while this episode knocked it out of the park. Tight writing, a great premise, fun acting, an actual theft and few plot holes -- everything I could ask for.
I'll take a second and remark on how Sophie's character arc is naturally leading her to leave the group for a while -- thus clearing the way for Gina's pregnancy. It isn't feeling forced, and that's a tribute to the writers. Not easy at all.
- PCat
Where did Nate's Tesla go? I loved the Tesla.
I'm guessing Hyundai's paying a bit more for product placement.
OK, the past few episodes had me worried. They just weren't up to par of the first season. No worries now. "The Two Live Crew Job" is my favorite show to date. Great job!
That was the praise now some critiques/suggestions.
Make the new crew re-occurring either opposing or allies.
Have Will back as a re-occurring nemesis.
Have Noa Tishby back period!
Hardison's needs to tone it back a bit. My family has started a game of stating where he goes too far. Like when talking with the guards " your the red in my red cross" - too far.
Priest in the vault of the bank "You're the twinkle in Twinkle little start" - Way to far.
Otherwise I love the character.
Hardison's needs to tone it back a bit. My family has started a game of stating where he goes too far. Like when talking with the guards " your the red in my red cross" - too far.
Priest in the vault of the bank "You're the twinkle in Twinkle little start" - Way to far.
Otherwise I love the character.
I'm pretty sure he's meant to be going too far. Hardison's specialty is computer crimes. He sits in a room by himself and presses buttons to make things happen. He's pretty much entirely new to grifting.
Considering that, he does amazingly well, particularly in the Juror #6 Job, but I think part of the reason he manages to pull off an in-person con is that he always goes over-the-top with this incredibly exuberant confidence. Hardison doesn't give people room to question his sincerity when he's grifting; his characters are so intense the marks think there's no way someone could be making this personality up. Kind of like how Nate's characters are always incredibly huge assholes or out-of-their-mind drunk. Being super-intense shifts the mark's frame of reference so they never think to compare the grifter to how a normal, non-con artist person would be behaving.
I must have been watching another show because the Leverage I watched was basically another silly episode put out by the writers that have taken this show so far from its roots it's terrible in comparison. The way I see it there are one of several situations in play here, a couple immediately come to mind...1) The writers are different and have taken the show off course 2) the producers have decided to try to expand the fan base by changing the show instead of giving the audience a chance to find it. Either way it's definitely a "dumbed-up" version of its original self. I hope it finds its way back because it was a fantastic show.
Anonymous said ...
I'm pretty sure he's meant to be going too far. Hardison's specialty is computer crimes. He sits in a room by himself and presses buttons to make things happen. He's pretty much entirely new to grifting.
Yeah I think you're on the mark. He's so good in the van and with the briefings. I think Juror #6 showed his promise so I would think the over the top scene would have Sophia coaching him when he pushes it. Like when they call Parker on her "differences".
Still a great show.
Hardison has been over the top since the premier. Remember that cringe worthy salute to the state police?
Thats his style and to complain now about something thats been there from the beginning seems rather nit picky.
I loved the ep! And Will Wheaton? Well Bonus!
Did the team actually Send Chaos the real painting? I saw that when they opened the box there was a sticky note that said "This is the real one!" But I guess I can't see them letting go a priceless work of art. Or have they really all evolved so much that they don't even think twice about it?
I fully admit I have not read the thread; on the other hand I'm still watching the episode. What I want to know is: did anyone in the writers' room utter the phrase "Earth-2 Leverage Team?" 'Cuz that's what we have here, and it is AWESOME.
Who does the original music for the show? The stuff over the funeral in particular was really great, very funky.
Also, it was twittered (....maybe?) that Christian's forehead/eyebrow wound was the reason he wore a hat in the Two Live Crew episode, but looking at screencaps of The Top Hat Job, in the beginning he has a hat and a bandana over what looks like a gauzy bandage thing, so were these shot out of order?
thedrummertobeat -- Christian Kane has sung in other episodes and that sounded like him singing in the cemetary scenes.
LOVED the ep! Wil Wheaton was great! I really love this show.
AND, I'm glad to hear you have been picked up for a third season.
So, WHERE will you be filming 3rd season and WHEN will filming begin? Portland again? This winter? Next spring?
Please, please, pleeeeeeeease bring back Apollo!!! I loved watching him and Parker squaring off. Everybody was awesome!! (Fangirly squeeage is fangirly)
And I don't squee.
Note: Not so subtle subtext -- Moar Apollo!!
Great Episode and congrats on Season 3! Wil W was wonderful.
I have been rewatching Season 1 after reading some posts from other viewers in order to get more up to speed.
I have a quick question for you.
While I am a fan of Christian with long hair, it seems to really be getting so long it is in his way more. Does it affect filming at all? I mean - how can you fight when you can't see!
It seemed more practical at somewhere in between pilot and now.
Thanks and thank you for taking the time to respond to everyone.
@Ruth
Jensen probably wouldn't have time. V.V. busy having his own legion of screaming fans on Supernatural. Check out buddyTV, he's been No.1 on there for AGES, sadly beating Christian Kane by a mile. Would be very awesome though, or David Boreanaz. Should get Christian to pull some strings, lol.
Loved the ep. I'd read all the comments but I just don't have the time. I definately was getting very excited in the very tense fight scene. I can't wait for more Leverage. Kudos on a 3rd season!
@Tara: I don't know if I'd classify Marlowe as hard boiled Chandler typically had a softer touch than Spillane. I'd say Robert Mitchum is the quintessential Marlowe though.
As for the episode, how much does it cost(in general) to make an episode of LEVERAGE? I mean without the marketing push, just actors,writers, sets, and crew.
@Ed Dravecky - I like what you did there. Kudos!
On that note, will we ever get a small Coupling reference in the show? Or will it be like the Kane/Anderson wink in The Snow Job - considered but never shown?
Another amazing episode! Quick question -- since Nate runs the nastiest crew *this* side of the Atlantic, any chance you bring on the cast of Hustle so they can take on the toughest crew on the other side of the pond?
What an excellent guest cast.
I count at three homage to Star Trek with Wil, Kobyoshi Maru and Noa.
These last episodes have been stellar. The glimpses of Eliot are cracking me up. Keep up the excellent work. Congrats on another season.
By the way, I only knew you from JonRog's story hour. I knew what you did, but I had not connected you with the series until this season. It is cool as heck I liked it so much then found out it was you.
The Tesla would be a bit impractical in Boston. Servicing them is quite a specialization, and the nearest dealership is in NYC.
Didn't they bury her as Katherine something? Why is the headstone at the end Sophie?
don't people read past comments?
I mean, seriously?
More congrats on the renewal! I love that smart shows written by smart people get recognition occassionally.
And now for a question that is pure character development pron:
Chaos tells Stark that everyone was always more afraid of Sophie than of him. Afraid? I can see respecting her more than him, but afraid? Was this a deliberate word choice, and if so, why?
You once wrote that "rain is cheap night." Taking some guests from out of town on the WB studio tour, I mentioned this remark to them...and then we couldn't figure it out. I suppose night shoots must be more expensive because, I dunno, it's time and a half for the crew or something? But can rain really pass for night?
And while I'm on the subject of questions about TV production in general and not about your show in particular, how many morgues are there? Is there just one morgue on someone's lot and everyone rents it to do their shoots there? Cuz come to think of it, they all look exactly the same, with the same rows of square stainless steel doors, always shot from the same angle, with that same door to the left.
MORE WIL
And put him to work for Sterling. ;)
Is it just me or has the series gotten new writers (or lost old ones?) I've watch two episodes from the new season and they definitely seem to be not as well written as the first season. There's way too much joking around now (especially the one where they were competing against another crew of thieves).
@Sean; See, to me, Chandler, Hammett, and Cain defined "hardboiled detective fiction" as a genre back in the 1920s and 1930s, whereas I think of Spillane as 2nd generation hardboiled. Mike Hammer is to Marlowe and Sam Spade to me what the 21st century Bourne films are to the 20th century Bond films, if that makes sense? Almost a meta-reflection of the earlier archetypes, with certain aspects (sex and violence in particular) exaggerated and refined to suit a new and changed post-WWII audience. And Fickling's "Honey West" and Gregory MacDonald's "Fletch" do the same in the 1960s and 1970s.
Erm... sorry! That got kinda wanky. I AM A GEEK, OKAY? But definitely Chandler's work isn't quite as bleak as Hammett and Cain's, and Marlowe is a more sympathetic and empathetic protagonist by far than, say, the Continental Op.
If the bomb was motion activated, then how did Sophie pick it up and walk that far into her apartment with out it going off? And she wasn't that far away from bomb when it went off and the resulting explosion blew out all the windows but she was ok?
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