Yes, well, "regular dispatches" from SDCC rather depended on the web connection on my Treo not suddenly collapsing and spitting cryptic error messages at me. As if there were any other kind.
Via Treo-cam, that's interweb game-theory blogger (and former professional gamer) Alice, myself in the middle, and the infamous Cory Doctorow, who at that very captured moment is blogging. With his brain. His Comic-con photos are here.
I don't often take or look at photos of myself -- usually wielding the camera -- so it's always a bit disconcerting to see the Roscommon barman I'm genetically predisposed to be obliterate any possibility that I might ever come across as a swanky Hollywood writer. A suit doesn't improve matters; I look like the same bartender, just on his way to a funeral.
Maybe a shot with the adorable, elfin Blue Beetle artist Rafael Albuquerque ...
... bloody hell. Time to give it up, open the lesbian pub I've always talked about and just settle back behind the pine where I belong.
Rafael, by the way, brought an astounding number of art supplies to our signing. While many artists crank out pencil or pen sketches for fans, I could see Rafael switching between watercolors, pencil smudges, Sharpies and more on each sketch. The lad draws at some weird sort of distorted redshift speed.
I didn't take a lot of pictures, as I prefer to walk around and actually read the little indies and talk to the booth humans. However, for a bit of scale, some bleached-out but still readable pics taken from up in the DC greenroom over the main floor.
Now imagine that extending for twenty five rows to the left, and twenty five more rows to the right.The Con's current scale hammers home the hackiness of the standard American media narrative. I noticed multiple news camera crews, and each time it was the same. 124,000 people at the Con, give or take. But if you turn on your news coverage you won't see the giggling, happy five year-olds with their parents, having the "together family time" we're always whinging on about. You won't see the young woman who wrote and drew a comic about her time as a soldier in Israel. You won't see the scrum of young Marines I spotted as they compared Magic the Gathering cards. You won't meet the junior high teachers who are using my comic in their predominantly Hispanic classrooms to spark discussion about racial representation in the media. You won't see the indie film-makers, the kid who shot this 25 minutes in a week and left every industry pro who stumbled across him slack-jawed.
A thousand stories, tens of thousands of familes ... yet the newshacks couldn't wait to hustle up the dozen or so real freaks in costumes, the literally .001% that gave them what they wanted. Not even the kids in the Harry Potter outfits, or the Japanese anime kids, or even the clever unfolding Transformer rigs -- no, they found every empty-eyed overweight forty-five year old Flash or flab-rolled part-time stripper Catwoman and latched on tight for the creepy interview.
In the American media there are two constants. In politics, it is always and forever 1968, and liberals are Dirty Fucking Hippies. In culture, anyone who decides to poke their head out of the cultural world of the CBS primetime line-up is a sad, basement-dwelling loner screaming into his Hello Kitty pillow as crackling video dubs of the original Spider-Man cartoon flicker on his television.
I still came away happy, though. I saw literally thousands of families rummaging through comics, and games, and alternative media ... and the kicker is they didn't know they were supposed to be embarrassed.
Oh, and I saw a drunken Will Wheaton kill a guy with a 20-sided die. That was pretty cool too.
And this. I'm still not sure how I feel about this.
82 comments:
You should have seen me take out that film crew with 3d4. That was a hell of a feat.
Is it a specific feat, like Power Attack or iron Will, or -- oh, sorry just realized what you meant.
Happy Birthday, by the way.
Thanks, man. Great post, by the way. I said essentially the same thing about Star Trek conventions in a recent article, too.
Mass Media is fucking retarded.
John, you know I love you (and Wil, too) but you guys are wrong about mass media. Wired doesn't sell the kind of numbers it does by retelling the cliche narrative about nerds and science fiction; we do it by embracing the influence of geeks on culture. Or how about Entertainment Weekly? They're huge, and they've embraced the truth that the war between geeks and jocks is over, and the geeks won.
(Part of the evidence of that victory being the success of the Transformers movie, by the way, and the fact that so many people now claim to have been fans back in the day. Back when I was an adolescent geek, that meant social alienation, not "here is a zillion-dollar movie that we made for you.")
And I love you, Adam, and have a shiny idea for an article, finally. I'll call. But WIRED is not Mass Media.
WIRED is one very spiffy, hip and tiny element of Mass Media. WIRED is not CNN, Fox News, CBS, ABC, NBC. WIRED is not HOUSE, ACCORDING TO JIM or THE CLASS or CSI, which has recently, weirdly turned into "Have anything but vanilla sex, and you die horribly, after which the CSI shake their heads and cluck." (Should we all be reading GLASS TEAT again? Yes. Yes we should) And WIRED certainly as hell is not NEWSWEEK, TIME, the NEW YORK TIMES, any local paper or any local television news broadcast that make up what is considered, by most of the population, as "News".
And let's not kid ourselves. Last year's TV ratings are here
Even eliminating the reality shows, that's a whole lot of non-geek programming America's being fed -- and watching, by the way. Beauty of capitalism. I won't go so far as to say there's an agenda there, because there's not -- just as there's almost never an agenda for liberalism or conservatism in media. But entertainment executives are by and large very intellectually conservative, fear-driven fifty-year old men. There's a context, and there's also human nature: "If I don't get it, no one will get it." This, by the way, is why they hire young hip executives to help out. Sadly, most of these young hip executives are Harvard trained lawyers from filthily rich families.
I will tell you right now, this sentence has been uttered a million fucking times in Hollywood: "We've got to make sure it doesn't come across as geeky or too weird for our audience."
You kow what sentence has NEVER been uttered? "Let's really go geeky here, really comic-booky/fantasy/hard-core sci fi, because that's a loyal, passionate audience."
You know what rooms I have sat in. You know I bring this from the front line.
I absolutely promise you, you go into any office in Hollywood where they've made a fuckload of money off genre entertainment, they will spend an hour assuring you that the reason it made money was that they worked so hard to make sure it wasn't too out there, not that the original idea had so much goddam passion in it, it touched an audience which is, by and large, far more accepting of genre entertainment than the execs who make entertainment.
With the slow influx of alternate financing and younger people who are geeks finally moving into power positions, this is changing. But even if it's changing in actual production, it certainly as shit isn't changing at any deliberate speed in the section of the media which has anointed itself as the arbitrers of what is mainstream.
Don't get me wrong, I'm the guy who wrote "the Geeks Won" essay for a website launch some four years ago. My point is rather that Geek Culture -- the Matrix, Star Wars, Comic book movies which generate billions of dollars, video games that have 4 million players -- are indeed mass culture, but they are not acknowledged, universally as mass geek culture by what is universally considered to be Johnny Square jaw media. There is, if not a sanitization, a blurring of the origins and context of most genre entertainment. For every "Wow, the mainstream sure has changed" toned article, I'll find you nine "Holy Shit! Chinese people gold-farm! How fucking weird is THAT?! Holy shit, there are whole families dressed as Jedi? How fucked up is THAT?"
So many people can claim to be fans of genre stuff because, well, genre material has infiltrated culture to a greater degree, and media has evolved in specific ways, etc, etc. And my point is that yes, maybe the geeks won -- but if you look at the official cultural scorekeepers, they're not hip to that. And in my opinion, they probably have no interest in becoming hip to that.
This will of course change. But let's not get giddy and pretend it already has.
Actually, to clarify -- I have no idea if WIRED has more circulation than the standard-issue "news" magazines. But it's not in the same idea-space. It doesn't call the cultural tune in te Establishment (I feel obliged to end the sentence with " maaaaaan" every time I type something like that ..."
But here's a simple thought experiment. Say I run for President. If I, say, played golf as a past-time, non one would even notice.
If I played, openly, Magic the Gathering as a past-time, would that be anything but a mocking freak-show media bloodbath? And MtG makes MORE money than the Transformers toy line. Hell, it will make more money than the Transformers MOVIE will make this year domestically. MtG is in theory MORE mainstream an interest than what will be one of the biggest, most popular movies of the year.
Now, granted, golf has many mopre player, sna dis much more mainstream. But what's important -- my point, basicaly -- is what the media's reaction would be.
Bloodbath. Mocking. Freak show. Bloodbath.
Oh, dude, we have an agenda. We just can't tell you what it is.
Diggin' the Jedi beard, by the way.
If you read most any blog thread about Harry Potter these days, you'll find a post or two along the lines of
"What is WITH those people to line up at midnight to read some kids book that isn't even that good? I read one and I didn't get it?"
Sometimes they aren't that polite.
What I figure is that we who are geeks are used to being outside the cultural mainstreams. Every Sunday, America watches football, and we don't. Or they watch NASCAR, and we don't. Or they stay glued to Survivor or American Idol, and we don't.
But there are lots of folks who aren't used to being on the outside looking in. And it makes them very uncomfortable. The one way to resolve that discomfort is to mock.
I have to confess that I am tickled by the prospect of a Chief Executive that plays Magic the Gathering. I mean, instead of sports (or poker) metaphors in his (or her) speeches.
Imagine: "Al-Qaeda is basically playing a Red/Black deck, and we all know the best counter to that is..."
"Our army is tapped out. Everything is turned down at the moment."
Re: Cherry video...
I think just because the girl "lost some weight" doesn't mean she isn't attractive...okay, hawt!
Imagine: "Al-Qaeda is basically playing a Red/Black deck, and we all know the best counter to that is..."
"See, insurgents are basically trying to millstone our library of political will. That's just how it works. This is why, regrettably, we've had to go with the Cheny-designed Black graveyard recycler deck..."
All joking about MtG aside, we will have an XBox playing President sooner than we think.
Bill...seriously, dude, you need a girlfriend. ;-)
KJC
Yeah, you're right, John. You've certainly spent more time in the bellies of various overculture beasts than I. And your educated guess about circulations of newsmagazines versus circs of, say, Wired is dead on. (Last time I looked, Time had something like 5 million subscribers; Wired has something like 680,000.)
In an attempt to salvage a shred of credibility, however, I'll say that the volume of subculture coverage--Wired, Gizmodo, Wizard, Boing Boing--has an additive affect. Even if it's not having an impact on the Boomers (for whom I have nothing by class rage), it's changing the neurological maps of the Gen-Y and -Z kids they manage.
I love the image of political coverage using a MtG metaphor, though. I know some people; I'm going to suggest it.
(Hasn't CSI always been about paraphilias? And anyway, even the people who dare to have vanilla sex get axed. That's how Jorja Fox's character ended up under that car in the season finale, right? Dating CSIs is like dating any of the Cartwright boys.)
I think the beard is more bartender looking than your clean shaven look - not that there's anything wrong with that. :) But the pictures of you I've seen in a suit sans beard do not at all look like a bartender on the way to a funeral. In any case, the choice is certainly yours...or, perhaps, your wife has some input, as well? And I can certainly understand anyone not wanting to shave.
I've been trying to come up with something incisive to say about that film clip, but I'm stumped.
STUMPED
somebody please put an end to my madness.
Would it be lecherous to point out that the model in that video clip has a great body? I mean, she has really great gun.
Good point about geek culture, John. The sad thing is, I think I've even spotted it in what is technically geek culture. Take the works of Joss Whedon. If you're a male outcast, you can make occasional quips about relatively popular comic book heroes and mainstream sci-fi shows and still be considered the comic relief. If you're a female geek, you know about computers, engineering, and quantum physics, and are adorably shy.
If you're a MALE geek, then you play D&D, quote Monty Python, know everything about anything geeky... and are weak, powerless, and treated with an odd mixture of pity and scorn by the Cool People Who Go Out And Fight Evil (e.g., the Troika, that dot-com millionaire on Angel).
Thank you, Absinthe and Wil for jumping in with me...
See, ladies - this is how men think:
We look at WHAT YOU HAVE and NOT what you don't...
Besides, anything that saves on shoes has to be a plus.
Gene Roddenberry used to complain, in his genteel sort of way, that even though he'd meet all sorts of people from all walks of life at Star Trek cons, inevitably he'd turn on the TV or pick up the paper and see that the writer or reporter focused in on the guy dressed as an Andorian and the guy with about 100 buttons on his vest. I think that that happened for the same reason that we saw all of those "ZAP! BAM! POW! Comics aren't just for kids anymore" articles, or why the NYT recently did an article expressing astonishment that librarians had social lives and interests that didn't involve books and cats.
They're lazy. They could either write something that treats geek culture with a modicum of respect, or they could write the same old sneering putdown and suck up the ratings or pageviews from everyone who's outraged, yet again. And if they're pushing away potential readers, viewers, and/or subscribers? Well, they'll worry about that next quarter.
I once asked Zvi Mowshowitz "when a large, powerful military fights an asynchronous war on the insurgence' home turf, which side has inevitability?"
He claimed it came down to play skill, but I think he's wrong.
(10 geek points if that meant anything.)
we will have an XBox playing President sooner than we think.
i.e., for the past six years. What else do you think Cheney keeps in that man-sized Mohler safe?!
great post.
In response to Justin Cognito: I agree entirely. Is there, or has there been, such a thing as a "hot male geek" in television or movies? 'Cause I'm blanking. Doesn't mean there isn't, but I can think of hot female geek characters much more easily.
As well, on the subject of activities that are "mainstream" and those which are "geeky" and the divide between, one thing you can check to see how accepted certain activities are is to see how they're represented in other media like T.V. and movies. For recent example, in Live Free or Die Hard that on hacker who goes boom early in the movie...you know the one, right? Nameless guy, dies to show the bad guys "mean business?" His roommate is playing Gears of War on the sofa. We even get a few seconds of gameplay on screen. But, besides the obvious product placement opportunity, the movie doesn't make a big deal out of it, doesn't linger on it or use it to say "HEY, THIS GUY'S A GEEK!" Not that video games have been geeky for a while, but you know what I mean.
Now, go back a ways. Remember E.T.? They had sort of the same thing going there with the D&D game in the beginning of the movie. The game wasn't really so much a "geek alert" moment so much as a bit of set dressing.
But these days, if a character is shown playing D&D it's to show how irredeemably geeky they are. Guys who play D&D are invariably skinny or overweight, have poor hygiene and/or social skills, obnoxious in attitude, etc. Or it's like a secret shame. "Oh yeah, he's really cool...except he plays D&D."
D&D's just an example. It could be something like Magic: the Gathering-style card games, participating in the SCA, a halfway-realistic interest in computers (not as uber-hacking plot McGuffins, either. Movie hackers, usually protagonists rather than supporting characters, tend to be portrayed as cute or kinda-hot, even the guys. Again, see Live Free, Die Hard.)...hell, it could be chess. Is chess still geeky? Probably. My point is that activities/hobbies which are considered "geeky" will be used as commentary on the characters who participate in them. Activities which aren't considered "geeky" will simply be a piece of background or a passing mention, not lingered on. This is a good way to track the "geek factor" of certain activities. When you next see a movie where the (well-dressed, well-mannered) protagonists are, say, casually playing a game of Magic, or a group of people are playing Vampire without being portrayed as clove-smoking, Hot Topic-shopping douchebags, that's when you know that that activity has been accepted.
I think there are certainly a few hot geeky guys on TV, both currently and in the past.
I think the titular star of Jake 2.0 was definitely supposed to be a geek and hot, thought he fact the show didn't last long may not be a help there.
Off the top of my head, I would also say probably Greg the fairly geeky former lab tech on CSI, though it seems since he's been becoming a real CSI his geekiness is being downplayed.
Also, Gus on Psych may just about be the biggest geek on television. Coin collecting, comic books, sci-fi, dinosaurs, spelling. He's all over the place. His geekiness and/or nerdiness is certainly used for comic value but he also doesn't exist purely for comic relief, usually something he knows is crucial to solving the crime.
I suspect there are a select few others, but that's all I can think of at the moment.
For geek women, they're certainly expected to be hot, but then *all women on television* are expected to be hot, whether they play the geek, the slut, the whore, the mother, the reporter, or the cop. Did I forget any of the few jobs women are allowed to have on TV? Oh, right, MDs and anthropologists...I think that about covers it.
1. You should make a frontpage article out of your comments, Roger, good read.
2. Guam Senator plays World of Warcraft and Diablo.
http://kotaku.com/gaming/politics-is-more-fun/?view=full
This came up last week. Never followed to fallout, just saying it's out there.
3. The only answer I have for these things, and I know it's the most frustrating one possible, is: Give it time and keep fighting.
You actually point to some signs of progress yourself. It just takes time for the droves to catch up.
You work in one of the most change and risk-averse and conservative environments possible. That is, wherever there are bags of money.
Same as the news media.
But at least you have the foot in the door, keep pushing.
Throughout history, being different has always got you punished. Some differences were life-threatening, like being black or gay. Some just got you annoyed or appalled looks, like listening to that rock music.
But what else can you do then keep fighting for your thing?
This won't stop anyone from wanting to bang their head against the wall right now but it's all I've got.
"You won't see the indie film-makers, the kid who shot this 25 minutes in a week and left every industry pro who stumbled across him slack-jawed."
this is depressing. have you seen his film? he's a usc film student who spent $100,000 on his short. not some aw-shucks kid that pulled a rabbit out of a hat.
I have to disagree with your contention that the news media see liberals as "dirty hippies": the news media are those "dirty hippies." And they haven't gone conservative. The media are by and large politically liberal.
That said, I agree with the rest of your point. They perpetuate the stereotype -- thru their unbalanced coverage -- that people who read comics, or get excited with creativity because of their favorite show, or book, or movies after puberty are somehow losers.
Wil,
Nah man, it's not lecherous at all.
I mean, she's hot as hell and she's got a gun for a leg. What's not to like?
deepstructure --
100k is indeed indie. Most of it eas grant money from Panavision, etc. and I grant him a bit of exrtra credit for being a genuinely great action shooter and also a good eye for casting.
Hexadecimal --
While much of the media is politically liberal, a failry cursory examination of the sunday morning chat showsreflects an almost toal lack of anyone left of center. And culturally speaking, we've never been tighter. I respectfully disagree with you, and the data of what they DO as opposed o thwt they may BE reflects supports this opinion.
It's of a piece.
Kai Tave
Hot Male Geeks in Movies & Film,
(a completely subjective list)
- Banky Edwards
- Holden Macneil
- Eddie Izzard (and yeah, part of that is the comedy and all, but Wayne on The Riches is yummy and non-traditionally OCD, and Izzard edits Wikipedia for fun)
- Albert in Hitch (indeed, the whole thing there was that Hitch was trying to polish him up, but what got him the girl was the geekiness, and what got Hitch his girl was embracing his geek. And Kevin James, when not being Doug Heffernan, is downright adorable)
- Dante (he's sweet, he's funny, he's geek enough to keep up with Randal, and yeah, I'm aware that I'm showing a Kevin Smith bias)
- minor mention here of Vin Diesel and his 30 year D&D habit. Apparently interviews with him are hard to keep on track if the subject gets to gaming.
- Ferris Bueller - let's face it, in any real-world school, no one would want to have anything to do with him. Just in case. But he was cute, funny, creative, and more nerdy than you'd expect considering.
- Oh, and ALL the doctors on House are total geeks, and hot hot hot.
- Alton Brown. Trust me, no one would last on The Food Network with its 90% female audience if there wasn't a good shot of sex appeal there, in addition to his supergodlike food geekery. Note that they've made Mario Batali, the sort of guy I'm attracted to, but not a sexy spitfire, disappear.
- The Ninth and Tenth Doctors. Seriously sexed up, and sometimes I can barely look at David Tennant and keep from drooling, and The Doctor is super smart, geeky, everything a nerd of today wants to be to a thousand power. And tastier looking than candy.
- Most people in North America haven't seen it, but Torchwood is CHOCK full of sexy geeks, while my brain is overseas.
-Any Buffy watcher. I think they infuse them with a syringe at birth that makes them geeked out sexpots (until they reach 60, from the look of the Watchers Council, at which point they seem to shrivel)
I think geek girls have it much harder. "Why, Miss Johnson! Without your glasses on, you're beautiful!" Too bad Miss Johnson needs the freaking glasses to SEE.
Michael Shanks as Daniel Jackson was a super-geek, not with tech stuff but languages, archaeology etc. And despite the fact the guy clearly worked out he was also presented as the stereotypical sand-in-face type of non-jock geek. I'm no expert but he ain't ugly, right ?
(Stargate's actually quite decent at striking the balance, Sam Carter for instance is an uber-geek who also rides motor-bikes and loves speed as well as being pretty easy on the eyes)
Also, 'Sneakers', a geek classic, has Robert frikkin' Redford as a geek (though maybe slightly less so than his crew).
All in all, in most 'geek' movies you have exactly the same thing with the men as with the women, basically, they are of at least above average attractiveness - Johnny Lee Miller in 'Hackers', Ryan Philippe in 'Anti-trust', Hugh Jackman in 'Swordfish', Matthew Broderick in 'Wargames', Jeff Bridges/Bruce Boxleitner in 'Tron', Val Kilmer in 'Real Genius', Keanu Reeves in 'The Matrix' and on ...
I'm going to point to an old post by an LJ-friend of mine: Essentially, there are only three kinds of stories that mass media runs about any kind of subcultural group, and the reporter has almost certainly decided which one to go with before the fact. When they actually bother to attend an event, it's only to get "local color" in the form of quotes, pics, or footage to fit into their predetermined framework.
"The greatest trick the devil ever played was convincing the world he doesn't exist."
Let the mass media mock. Let them focus on the sideshow. Let them continue to pretend Michael Crichton and Tom Clancy don't write science fiction.
Let them continue to pretend that we are outsiders or on the fringe rather than quietly enforming more and more aspects of global culture.
Let them.
It makes for less resistance when the revolution comes.
And we all know what Resistance is.
You can't blame the mass media. Of the genre media coverage of SDCC -- what you'd see on Newsarama and the like -- the number of pictures of chubtoads in spandex greatly outnumbered those of happy kids with indie cred reading comics about Palestine while editing mashups of 60s cartoon theme songs.
BoingBoing devoted more space to homebrew Lego figures than to CC-licensed or 'new media' comics.
And I'm not convinced that the 300-pound Flash is the exception to the rule. I didn't go to SDCC and haven't been to a con in some years, but the Cheetoz-stained beardo, wheezing his way amongst the festering crowd to paw through back issues (or booth babes) has always been the backbone of the con scene, in my experience.
Hey, i'm sitting right here !
I work in a geek-laden industry (High-tech software) and there are plenty of good-looking men and women who are geeks or nerds. The guy who runs my local comic book shop is fit, healthy, well-dressed, good looking and a big comics geek. He is married and has 3 kids.
Also all the main characters on Psych are geeks, not just Gus.
Stephanie M.: Okay, I'll give you everyone on your list with one exception, and that's Vin Diesel. Vin Diesel may be a geek in real life, but I can't think of him ever being cast as a geek in a movie.
Which isn't to say I don't think it's great that he's an enthusiastic gamer. One of my Hollywood wishes is that someone does end up casting Mr. Diesel in a role where millions of Americans get to see him playing D&D on the big screen...polyhedral dice in one hand, Jack Daniels in the other, telling everyone at the table to roll for initiative. It'd be great.
No love for Hiro on Heroes? They went a little over the top in the middle of the season, but he seems to personify the "ad-dork-able" description.
I'm sorry.
I found no discernible physical differences between the majority of the SDCC attendees and the non-geek population at large.
Yeah, there were some overweight stereotypes and some slutty stereotypes and one or two actual corn nuts but there were, even among the cosplay set, a majority of folks of essentially normal proportions having some normal Halloween-esque fun. With their kids and their mates.
Yet none of them make the news because they don't inspire a snicker. The kid who made the AWESOME short film will get retroactively noticed next year, after he blows up, but he got NONE at SDCC that I know of.
Mainstream Media gravitates to the freak show in EVERY instance, regardless of venue.
Just ask Louis Farrakhan.
This is how mass opinion is ALWAYS shaped, so why should visions of geekworld be excluded?
Jeff:
He's cute, and a geek, and doubles with Masi Oka having the ILM cred, but he's not really being pushed as a bundle o' hawt. Hiro has actually been completely asexual, in a Batman with his Robin fashion, really.
If I was going for *cute*, I'd also have pitched Mr. Wheaton, who was totally cast to be not just a geek but a teen cutie, and it worked for me (he's 4 months older than me, and regardless of how manipulative I could see it being, I let it happen).
Now, the Numb3rs dudes. There's some sexy nerdness. Forgot about them last night.
Wish I could've been there, is all I'm saying.
I have to say first that owe Wil a major hug for turning me on to your blog.
It sounds like you had a great time at SDCC, and I'm glad to hear about the many varied people that weren't shown by the mainstream media.
As far as sexy geeks are concerned, what about Peter Diamandis (the Xprize guy)? Harrison "Indiana Jones" Ford? Kevin Smith is a babe. Neil Gaiman for cryin' out loud.
(I once had a discussion with someone about who was sexier, Michael Longcor or Tom Smith...Smith, of course...but those guys are filkers and one must have SOME standards)
I'm glad people (like Wil) are bringing their kids into geekdom. When my daughter was 12 we threw her to the gamers and now I have gamer grandchildren.
Keep up the good work!
No sir, take it from this Irishman, you don't look like a Roscommon Barman. Too much hair. You look more like a Sligo Pint-puller to me...
Fatal Frame Movie Please >.<
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So, I do not actually consider this may have success.
Penyakit ini umumnya muncul karena penderita mengejan terlalu keras pada saat buang air besar. Dengan mengejan terlalu keras, maka pembuluh darah di sekitar anus dapat melebar dan pecah menimbulkan infeksi dan pembengkakan yang berakhir pada masalah wasir atau ambeien tersebut.
Penderita Penyakit kondiloma atau Kutil Kelamin yang telah terinveksi disarankan untuk segera melakukan pengobatan secepat mungkin sebelum Virus HPV penyebab kutil kelamin makin banyak berkembang biak di dalam sel darah makin lama dibiarkan akan memperparah kondisi organ vital karena kutil kelamin akan terus membesar sehingga terlihat seperti jengger ayam untuk penderita yang baru tertular kurang dari satu bulan biasanya akan lebih cepat ditanggulangi obat kutil kelamin Paling ampuh dari De Nature dan terbaik ada hanya di http://obatkutildikemaluan.blogdetik.com/ untuk mendapatkan informasi yang lebih jelas mengenai pengobatan kutil pada kelamin silahkan kontak langsung di nomer 0852 808 77 999 atau 0859 7373 5656 Bagaimana mengobati Ambeien itu sendiri. pengobatan yang terbaik untuk Ambeien adalah dari luar dan dalam sehingga Ambeien benar benar tuntas dan tidak akan kambuh lagi. obat Ambeien terbaik "Ambeclear dari De Nature" AlamiAdalah obat Ambeien herbal yang memang terbaik untuk mengobati Ambeien, dan sudah terdaftar di badan obat dan makanan (BPOM) dengan nomer registrasi POM TR: 133 374 041. terbuat dari bahan alami antara lain terdiri Daung Ungu, Mahkota Dewa dan Kunyit Putih.
cara yang alami menyembuhkan penyakit wasir ambeien secara alami dengan menggunakan daun ungu serta mahkotadewa aman untuk ibu hamil tanpa operasi cukup dengan menggunakan obat wasir herbal ambeclear terbuat
wasir ambeien bisa sembuh tanpa harus di operasi maupun injeksi cukup dengan obat wasir ambeien herbal ambeclear herbal de nature dari daun ungu serta mahkotadewa aman untuk ibu hamil
Penyakit kencing nanah bisa disebabkan oleh beberapa faktor seperti seks bebas, penularan, virus hpv, lingkungan, gaya hidup dan lainnya, Maka dari itu kita harus waspada dengan penyakit kencing nanah ini, karena penyakit kencing nanah sangatlah berbahaya, Namun untuk anda yang menderita penyakit kencing nanah, maka anda tidak perlu khawatir,
Berapa Harga untuk Obat Wasir Ambeien alami daun ungu Ambeclear – Ambeien adalah gangguan atau penyakit yang terjadi pada saluran pencernaan manusia
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pengobatan herbal
MANTAB * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
MANTAB * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ***
MANTAB * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *******
MANTAB * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * **********
Cara yang sering di lakukan untuk menghilangkan kutil kelamin adalah dengan cara pembedahah atau operasi, cara ini tentu memerlukan dana yang tidak sedikit. metode Pilihan pembedahan yang dapat Anda lakukan
MANTAB *
Bismillaahirrohmaanirrokhiim ???????????????????????????????????
Bismillahhirrohmaanirrokhim.... *********************************
Sekitar Vagina Tumbuh Daging, Berbahayakah? Kutil Pada Kepala Penis mirip bunga kol atau jengger ayam, Merupakan Penyakit Yang diakibatkan Oleh Virus.Kutil kelamin, atau disebut juga condyloma acuminata, adalah kutil atau daging berwarna kulit atau keabuan yang tumbuh di sekitar alat kelamin dan
Bismillahirrohmannirrokhim ........................
Sebelum kita membahas tentang pengobatan ambeien, dalam kesempatan ini
saya ingin menjelaskan sekilas tentang ambeien, agar kita semua bisa
memahami benar apa itu penyakit ambeien
Bismillahhirrohmaanirrokhim.... ***************************
Bismillahirrohmannirrokhim ......................................
Bismillahirrohmannirrokhim ...............................
???????????????????????????????????????
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
???????????????????????????????
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manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur manjur
alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami alami
Terimakasih,,, infonya sangat bermanfaat...
jangan lupa kunjungi juga ya website saya...
Tumbuh Kutil Di Dubur
Kutil Di Sekitar Dubur
Benjolan Daging Pada Kemaluan Wanita
Cara Mengobati Daging Tumbuh Di Dubur
Obat Untuk Menghilangkan Kutil Di Dubur
Cara Mengobati Kutil Tumbuh Di Anus
Cara Menyembuhkan Kutil Di Dubur
Cara Mengobati Kutil Kelamin Di Dubur
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